Subject: File: "INDEX-L LOG9905A" ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 00:29:48 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: ROBJRICH@AOL.COM Subject: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers All - Well, the thread on legal indexing, and the comment that a support group and/or 12-step program might be needed by defrocked lawyers plying the indexing trade, has prodded me out of my lethargy to expand this [semi-serious] suggestion to indexers in general. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A Twelve-Step Program For Indexers: 1. We admitted that we were powerless over clients - that once out of our hands our indexes had become unmanageable. 2. Came to believe that only self-confidence and a Power of Detachment could restore us to sanity. 3. Made a decision to turn our professional lives and reputations over to the practice of our chosen calling as we understand it. 4. Made a searching and fearless review of the organization and style of our indexes, always keeping in mind that there is no One Right Way. 5. Admitted to ourselves and a few trusted colleagues the exact nature of our errors and anxieties. 6. Were entirely ready to remove all these defects of style, accuracy and self-confidence. 7. Humbly asked God to help us make the next deadline. 8. Made a list of all editors and colleagues we had made unkind comments about, recognizing that they probably were stressed to the max and were doing the best they could. 9. Made amends to such editors and colleagues wherever possible, except when to do so simply stirred the pot and exposed us to further hassle. 10. Continued to take inventory of our indexes, and when we were wrong hoped that we could catch the errors in time. 11. Sought, through prayer and chocolate, to improve our speed and accuracy, praying only that when we overcommit we have the will and power to carry it out. 12. Having come to an understanding about how stressful and difficult indexing can be, tried to be supportive to newbies and colleagues who were going through their dark nights of the soul. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Best wishes, Bob Richardson ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 30 Apr 1999 22:53:30 -0600 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kate Welsh Subject: Re: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers In-Reply-To: <19990501043040Z41178-20250+109@edtnps03.telusplanet.net> I love it! -- so much, I've already posted it in my office. Now, if only I had a mantra... Kate Welsh, BA(English), LLB kwelsh@planet.eon.net Indexing - Research - Substantive editing - Stylistic editing - Writing Briefs - Legal materials - Manuals - Plain language materials - Policies -----Original Message----- From: Indexer's Discussion Group [mailto:INDEX-L@BINGVMB.CC.BINGHAMTON.EDU]On Behalf Of ROBJRICH@AOL.COM Sent: Friday, April 30, 1999 10:30 PM To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L Subject: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers All - Well, the thread on legal indexing, and the comment that a support group and/or 12-step program might be needed by defrocked lawyers plying the indexing trade, has prodded me out of my lethargy to expand this [semi-serious] suggestion to indexers in general. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ A Twelve-Step Program For Indexers: 1. We admitted that we were powerless over clients - that once out of our hands our indexes had become unmanageable. 2. Came to believe that only self-confidence and a Power of Detachment could restore us to sanity. 3. Made a decision to turn our professional lives and reputations over to the practice of our chosen calling as we understand it. 4. Made a searching and fearless review of the organization and style of our indexes, always keeping in mind that there is no One Right Way. 5. Admitted to ourselves and a few trusted colleagues the exact nature of our errors and anxieties. 6. Were entirely ready to remove all these defects of style, accuracy and self-confidence. 7. Humbly asked God to help us make the next deadline. 8. Made a list of all editors and colleagues we had made unkind comments about, recognizing that they probably were stressed to the max and were doing the best they could. 9. Made amends to such editors and colleagues wherever possible, except when to do so simply stirred the pot and exposed us to further hassle. 10. Continued to take inventory of our indexes, and when we were wrong hoped that we could catch the errors in time. 11. Sought, through prayer and chocolate, to improve our speed and accuracy, praying only that when we overcommit we have the will and power to carry it out. 12. Having come to an understanding about how stressful and difficult indexing can be, tried to be supportive to newbies and colleagues who were going through their dark nights of the soul. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Best wishes, Bob Richardson ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 06:25:57 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kim Harris Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 01/05/99 03:57:26 GMT Daylight Time, PDepri5514@AOL.COM writes: << n a message dated 4/30/99 1:15:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Brianp@MS.NCGA.STATE.NC.US writes: << It does not take a lawyer to index legal materials any more than it takes a nuclear physicist to index those materials. Knowledge of the language of the subject and some familiarity of the major issues are all that is needed and these can be picked up fairly easily. >> >> It's slightly more complicated than that, I feel. A non-legally trained person can, of course, index legal materials but there are a great many terms of art that a non-lawyer may not be aware of or realise the importance of (unless they concentrate only on legal texts and become familiar over time with the terminology). For example, if the term 'identity of carrier' appeared just like that as a sentence in a shipping law book, someone who was not familiar with the significance of the term may not use it as a main entry. There are numerous other examples. Kim ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 08:49:30 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Cynthia Bertelsen Subject: Errata in proofs At 09:10 PM 4/30/99 -0300, Noeline Bridge wrote: >Often, the proofreader is working on the text at the same time I'm= compiling >the index, so I'm aware that most, of not all, of the typos will be caught. >However, I have found that editors do want to have my list, or the pages on >which I've noted errors, just to make sure. If the error is a major one, >perhaps one that is repeated in at least several places or one that affects >the page numbers, I let the editor know immediately; with others, soon; and >gently, apologetically, always. I have had proofs arrive that are second or even third passes that contain numerous errors. True, there are proofreaders going over the text at the same time as the indexer, but sometimes there are errors with name spellings, for example, that can only be caught when the names are listed together in the way they are in an index. As much as I rather dislike writing that last cover letter/communiqu=E9 to the editor, I always include= a list of errors and inconsistencies (which I have flagged with post-it notes as I go through the text). Several times I have had grateful editors and authors thank me for my efforts, which is why I continue to do it, though I am not being paid extra to do so. The continued business is reward enough. If the error is a major one with page number order problems, etc., like Noeline, I will call the editor about it right away. My list of errors usually contains simple typos, name problems, factual errors sometimes, inconsistent spellings of some foreign words, authors cited in the text that are not included in the bibliography, and so on. Note: I am sure most of you do this but when I learned how to index (thanks Virgil!) my professor told us to always check the page numbers as soon as the proofs arrived. When I send in my list, I usually state, "I found the following errors or inconsistencies in the text:" and then list them by page order and location on the page (1st para, 2nd para, etc.). One last comment, something I think about often: isn't it amazing that an index has to be perfect the first time around when so often it is clear that cleaning up errors in the proofs goes on until the very last moment? The author has had years to work on the book. We indexers get a week to a month to digest the information and organize it into an index, essentially rewriting the book in code as it were. I say we owe ourselves a big hand, quite frankly! Cynthia ***************************************** Cynthia Purdy Bertelsen Bertelsen Indexing Services Cookbooks and Food Writing a Specialty cbertel@usit.net Web page: http://www.usit.com/cbertel/ "When we no longer have good cooking in the world, we will have no literature, nor high and sharp intelligence, nor friendly gatherings, no social harmony." --Careme ****************************************** ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 06:01:44 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Carolyn Weaver Subject: Garbled messages One relatively simple solution to the 'garbled messages' problem: make sure that your email program default is to send all messages as text files -- not as formatted documents. Until such time as we have a truly universal standard for online communications, messages sent to multiple recipients need to be set to the lowest common denominator -- plain text. Reserve Word98 and html-formatted messages for those you KNOW that can interpret them. For everyone else, send email to discussion lists as plain text, and send documents to your personal correspondents as .rtf files. That way, it doesn't matter what software people are using; they should be able to read what you're sending them. Carolyn Weaver Weaver Indexing Service ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 06:52:37 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Pam Rider Subject: Re: medical/pharmaceutical inquiry In-Reply-To: <199904302351.QAA00377@decibel.electriciti.com> I capitalize trademarked and registered drug name, but do not include the trademark or registered symbol (bug). That's because it's the tradition in newswriting and some are trademarked and some are registered. The authors I often get just decide such things off the top of the head and the research to determine whether a name is trademarked or registered would be better spent on other matters. Capping the name protects the proprietary rights to a name. I highly recommend a recent pill/drug reference--paperback is best because one needs to update no less than every 2 years. An indexer need not add generic names. I am most familiar with Trademark (generic) when listing more than one form. One definite needs to check on authors' memories in drug capitalization. Please, also be aware that side effects can be both adverse and positive and it is incorrect to assume that a "side effects" entry is only for negative drug reactions. Pam Rider Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth prider@electriciti.com prider@tsktsk.com ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 10:22:21 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: John and Kara Pekar Subject: Re: Hamlet on Errata > ROBJRICH@AOL.COM writes: > > > How do you deal with errata in the text, especially > > errors that don't affect the index, or that you can work around, but that > > should be corrected? I usually mark what I find and highlight the top right corner of the page, so I can quickly skim through and find them. I have been writing out a short list of errors and sending it along with my cover letter. I try to be very tactful about this, particularly with inconsistent spelling of names (the most common error I see.) If possible, I query the errors rather than saying, "Here's what's wrong." However, it may be more useful to send back the pages, rather than a list, as some people have suggested. Since I mark up my proofs pretty heavily, I've recently taken to using a specific highlighter color to make the errors stand out on the page. That way, if I do need to send back pages, they can find the errors without searching through all my notes and marks! As to what errata I alert the publisher about: It depends on what I know of the publisher. One of my publishers rarely has more than four or five errors, all of them punctuation, a repeated or missing word, or a dropped letter. Typos, in other words. I let them know, since it's clear that they take perfection seriously, and they usually try to schedule my deadline so that they have at least a little time before the whole thing goes to the printer. OTOH, when I realized 80 pages into a 400 p. book that the thing was crawling with inconsistent spellings of people's names, major grammatical and punctuation errors, etc., I let them know immediately, and they asked me to mark and send back those pages. If I know a particular publisher or project lacks the time to make the changes, I would only do the "egg-on-the-publisher's face" ones, as someone called them. I have caught factual errors occasionally. My favorites: two current Democratic congressional leaders were included in a list of Republican congressional leaders (!) And a map of Virginia was missing the "detached" portion which is on the Delmarva peninsula. Residents of that part of Virginia tend to get a bit testy about being left out, and it happens to them frequently. Kara Pekar Wordsmith Indexing Services jkpekar@crosslink.net ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 11:00:55 -0400 Reply-To: kamm@sky-software.com Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Kamm Y. Schreiner" Subject: Re: Garbled messages In-Reply-To: <199905011339.JAA03359@mx02.erols.com> Hi Carolyn, There is certainly a lot to be said for sending messages in text form to the list. However, the messages in question were not "sent". In other words, the people whose names appear as the sender, did not *write* or send the message. The current discussion is actually, for the most part, an attempt at determining their origin. The content and source of the messages are still unknown. There are a couple of theories, though. Happy Indexing! Kamm ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 12:16:42 -0300 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Noeline Bridge Subject: Hamlet on errata Janet Russell makes a good point in saying that disagreement with an expressed viewpoint (if I've paraphrased you accurately, Janet) shouldn't be reported as errata. I remember well a handbook for beginning college students which I indexed a few years ago. The writer was a woman teacher with very strong opinions on the inevitable suppression of and discrimination against woman in our society, including many warnings regarding this in her handbook. The overgeneralizations and polemical tone were irritating me, but I recognized them as none of my business. However, when I read a sentence that stated that it's perfectly possible for a college student to do a course in 19th century English literature and not realize that there were any major women writers at that time, my blood boiled. I majored in English literature in the 1960s, before the later wave of women's liberation, and with almost all male teachers (the only woman taught Anglo-Saxon), and we students were left in no doubt of the pre-eminence of George Eliot, and Emily and Charlotte Bronte; and of Jane Austen, much earlier (and 18th century in tone). As there has been no diminution of their status since the 60s (that I know of), I was sure that the writer didn't know what she was talking about, and I was tempted to point it out to the editor, whom I knew well. However, I didn't: I shrugged, thought thank goodness I'm not involved in editing the thing, and went on with the index. I have since wondered if I did the right thing, especially since I believe that one should point out the egg-on-the-publisher's-face errors, and I had a strong feeling that this could have been one. Noeline Bridge BRIDGEWORK nbridge@nb.sympatico.ca 295 Highfield Street Moncton, NB E1C 5R4 Canada phone 506-870-1113 ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 12:02:05 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Wright, Sharon F." Subject: Re: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers I love it! I'm posting this in my office! :-) -- Sharon W. x7255 Rm. 223 Sharon.Wright@Lexis-Nexis.com > -----Original Message----- > From: ROBJRICH@AOL.COM [SMTP:ROBJRICH@AOL.COM] > Sent: Saturday, May 01, 1999 12:30 AM > To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L > Subject: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers > > All - > > Well, the thread on legal indexing, and the comment that a support group > and/or 12-step program might be needed by defrocked lawyers plying the > indexing trade, has prodded me out of my lethargy to expand this > [semi-serious] suggestion to indexers in general. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > A Twelve-Step Program For Indexers: > > 1. We admitted that we were powerless over clients - that once out of > our > hands our indexes had become unmanageable. > > 2. Came to believe that only self-confidence and a Power of Detachment > could restore us to sanity. > > 3. Made a decision to turn our professional lives and reputations over > to > the practice of our chosen calling as we understand it. > > 4. Made a searching and fearless review of the organization and style of > our indexes, always keeping in mind that there is no One Right Way. > > 5. Admitted to ourselves and a few trusted colleagues the exact nature > of > our errors and anxieties. > > 6. Were entirely ready to remove all these defects of style, accuracy > and > self-confidence. > > 7. Humbly asked God to help us make the next deadline. > > 8. Made a list of all editors and colleagues we had made unkind comments > about, recognizing that they probably were stressed to the max and were > doing > the best they could. > > 9. Made amends to such editors and colleagues wherever possible, except > when to do so simply stirred the pot and exposed us to further hassle. > > 10. Continued to take inventory of our indexes, and when we were wrong > hoped > that we could catch the errors in time. > > 11. Sought, through prayer and chocolate, to improve our speed and > accuracy, > praying only that when we overcommit we have the will and power to carry > it > out. > > 12. Having come to an understanding about how stressful and difficult > indexing can be, tried to be supportive to newbies and colleagues who were > going through their dark nights of the soul. > > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > > Best wishes, > > Bob Richardson ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 13:37:34 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Carol Kennedy Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. -----Original Message----- From: Kim Harris >there are a great many terms >of art that a non-lawyer may not be aware of or realise the importance of My lawyer husband has found that indexes created by people with law degrees but no actual experience in doing law are often unhelpful to working lawyers. The terminology of theoretical law and practical law is not always the same. Carol Kennedy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 14:46:09 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Wright, Sharon F." Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. We've found that to be true, too. -- Sharon W. x7255 Rm. 223 Sharon.Wright@Lexis-Nexis.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Carol Kennedy [SMTP:colfaxgp@MINN.NET] > Sent: Saturday, May 01, 1999 1:38 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L > Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Kim Harris > > >there are a great many terms > >of art that a non-lawyer may not be aware of or realise the importance of > > > My lawyer husband has found that indexes created by people with law > degrees > but no actual experience in doing law are often unhelpful to working > lawyers. The terminology of theoretical law and practical law is not > always > the same. > > Carol Kennedy ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 13:08:42 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "J. Naomi Linzer" Subject: Re: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers In-Reply-To: <199905010430.VAA07842@neti.saber.net> Bravo, Bob! >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > >A Twelve-Step Program For Indexers: *****************************************************************************J. J. Naomi Linzer Indexing Services POB 1341 Redway, CA 95560 (707) 923-4361 jnlinzer@saber.net ****************************************************************************** http://www.asindexing.org <-- American Society of Indexers website. http://www.onelist.com/archives.cgi/indexstudents <--Indexing students e-mail-list. http://www.indexpup.com/index-list/FAQ <--Index-L e-mail list FAQS. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 07:11:12 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kim Harris Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 01/05/99 19:43:14 GMT Daylight Time, colfaxgp@MINN.NET writes: << >> That may be his view. There are many different types of law books. And my legal experience is not confined to merely doing a law degree. Still, if I was a medical practitioner, I'd prefer my textbooks to be indexed by someone with medical knowledge. How can it be otherwise? Kim ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 07:15:44 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kim Harris Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 01/05/99 19:43:14 GMT Daylight Time, colfaxgp@MINN.NET writes: << My lawyer husband has found that indexes created by people with law degrees but no actual experience in doing law are often unhelpful to working lawyers. The terminology of theoretical law and practical law is not always the same. >> Who does he suggest would be the 'best' person to do a law index? Someone qualified in chemistry? ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 10:21:43 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Susan Hernandez Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. On Sun, 2 May 1999 07:11:12 EDT Kim Harris writes: > Still, >if I >was a medical practitioner, I'd prefer my textbooks to be indexed by >someone >with medical knowledge. How can it be otherwise? > >Kim > One way for it to "be otherwise" is by the diligence of the indexer. I don't have a medical background, but I have done several biology books. They take me extra time because I look up everything. These books have been graduate level texts that assume a basic understanding of molecular biology. So I get books from the library and read up on it. The editors have been happy with the indexes, but I only accept the job if I have a generous deadline that leaves me the research time I need to do a good job. (I also don't want to look like an idiot.) Of course, my hourly rate on these books is quite low. My reason for taking them is not too crazy: just as many people turn to indexing to get out of the office, I turned to it to have an intellectual challenge while staying home to raise three kids. - Susan *************************************** Susan Danzi Hernandez BookEnd Indexing susanhernandez@juno.com (316) 789-0576 (Kansas) ___________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com/getjuno.html or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 12:15:31 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kim Harris Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 02/05/99 16:21:11 GMT Daylight Time, susanhernandez@JUNO.COM writes: << One way for it to "be otherwise" is by the diligence of the indexer. >> I totally accept that. What I was reacting to is the implication that it's somehow better not to be legally qualified to index law books. I suppose the theory is that ex-law students may have assumptions which don't apply when indexing practitioners' books. But by no means all law books are practitioner texts and people with law degrees are just as able as anyone else to dicriminate beween academic, student and practitioner books. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 12:22:48 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: JPerlman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. Well, I want to tell you that most medical books are not indexed by doctors or medical practitioners. I have an extensive science background from college and my professional life. I have an excellent reference library at home, in addition to all of the Internet sources. And with that equipment, I have successfully indexed books in many of the sciences -- medical, engineering, quantum physics ... to name a few. It may be all well and good to try to entice practitioners in a field to become indexers. Why not? If trained in the field and then as indexers, they should turn out the best, highest quality indexes. Absent that, though, and in the non-legal fields, the "absent that" condition is the norm, indexes are done by those with some training or background in the field and a lot of acquired knowledge and reference sources. My work is a great challenge to me. The situation may be not be the perfect one, as many see it, but it is what exists out there in the indexing world. How many doctors are indexers? How many physicist are indexers? Do those who index aerospace research have to have had space missions? Not at all. We'd have a lack of indexers! Expertise is important, but there are supply and demand factors at work in the industry also. Also, consider the money issues. How many physicians would want to work for $2-3/page to index medical books?! Janet Perlman SOUTHWEST INDEXING ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 13:02:20 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: PDepri5514@AOL.COM Subject: Re: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers Ok, ok. Where do we go for the program? The Index-L Clinic for those who chronically love punishment? :-) Patrick. ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 13:12:50 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: ROBJRICH@AOL.COM Subject: Even the NY Times... All - In an April 9 NY Times article on Microsoft's Windows strategy, there appeared: ".... Even with its consumer plans in a state of flux, Microsoft also announced plans for its corporate Windows 2000 operating system, raising new concerns that by fragmenting its product line the company may inadvertently sew confusion among customers. " ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ "SEW confusion"? Gawdamighty!! As you Sew, so shall you rip!! ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Bob ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 13:48:22 -0700 Reply-To: nkoenig Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: nkoenig Subject: Re: Even the NY Times... Well, I'm certainly in stitches over this one! >All - > >In an April 9 NY Times article on Microsoft's Windows strategy, there >appeared: > >".... Even with its consumer plans in a state of flux, Microsoft also >announced plans for its corporate Windows 2000 operating system, raising new >concerns that by fragmenting its product line the company may inadvertently >sew confusion among customers. " > >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ >"SEW confusion"? Gawdamighty!! As you Sew, so shall you rip!! >~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > >Bob > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 17:10:59 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: ROBJRICH@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Even the NY Times.... All - Well, I didn't mean to needle you, but I hope that NKoenig's comment starts an interesting thread..... Bob ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 15:43:42 -0700 Reply-To: nkoenig Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: nkoenig Subject: Re: Even the NY Times.... Ahem....... I for one am going to button up. >All - > >Well, I didn't mean to needle you, but I hope that NKoenig's comment starts >an interesting thread..... > >Bob > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 16:53:54 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Back Words Indexing Subject: Re: Even the NY Times... In-Reply-To: <66e77862.245de192@aol.com> EEEUUWWWW!! >".... Even with its consumer plans in a state of flux, Microsoft >also >announced plans for its corporate Windows 2000 >operating system, raising >>new concerns that by fragmenting >its product line the company may >inadvertently sew confusion >among customers. " ========================================================================= Date: Sat, 1 May 1999 09:27:53 PDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Yves_Fran=E7ois_Jeaurond?= Subject: (2) Upper Case In-Reply-To: <199904301542.LAA07507@mag1.magmacom.com> Ann Truesdale et al.: Hi. An aside. You may want to have two indexes, one for proper names ( u.c.), the other for common nouns and other what nots (l.c.). You write: "I definitely lean toward proper names only in caps rather than the all caps style." You do mean small caps? Cordially, Yves Jeaurond jingting@magma.ca ---------- > > Hi all, > > I have been following this thread, and I definitely lean toward proper = names > only in caps rather than the all caps style. Someone commented that the= all > caps style was more standard with medical books. I pulled down a couple= of my > medical books, and I could immediately see why this style is useful her= e. > First, there are few proper names, so no confusion there. Second, one = or two > entire columns of subentries under one main is not unusual. One book = I looked > at had 3 columns on a page. When one of those long lists of subs rolls = over > to a second column, having them in lower case helps a reader differenti= ate > them from the mains. It would be far better yet if they used "Main > (continued)" at the top of the column, but they don't. I guess we can't= have > everything. > > Alan wrote: > > > > Then I had the embarrassing experience, at a book launch, when the = launcher > > publicly mistook one of my lower case entries for a subentry, and = grossly > > misreported what the index revealed about the book. > > > Well, there *is* one in every crowd.... ;-) I don't know if we can = be made > responsible for a reader that obuse when we write indexes. > > > So now I think you have to take the typographical appearance of the = whole > > index into account. When most of the entries are proper names (as = often > > happens in a book about literature, or art, or music, for instance) = then it > > can be a good idea to capitalise the concept entries too, so that = they > don't > > get lost. > > > It seems to me that the concepts would be easier to pick out from the = names > if they were *not* capitalized. Typography could be an issue, but proba= bly > only if the puplisher picked an inappropriate font style for the index.= Would > be nice if we had some control over that, huh? > > Ann Truesdale ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 20:04:55 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Julie Sherman Grayson Subject: Re: Even the NY Times... --------------B97EC531FC9390C7DEE00B1B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > ".... Even with its consumer plans in a state of flux, Microsoft also > announced plans for its corporate Windows 2000 operating system, raising > new concerns that by fragmenting its product line the company may > inadvertently sew confusion among customers. " > Maybe Microsoft hopes that "a stitch in time will save nine"! ;-} --------------B97EC531FC9390C7DEE00B1B Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit 
".... Even with its consumer plans in a state of flux, Microsoft also
announced plans for its corporate Windows 2000 operating system, raising
new concerns that by fragmenting its product line the company may
inadvertently sew confusion among customers. "
Maybe Microsoft hopes that "a stitch in time will save nine"! ;-} --------------B97EC531FC9390C7DEE00B1B-- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 17:17:50 -0700 Reply-To: jeanmidd@prodigy.net Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Jean Middleton Subject: Re: (2) Upper Case I believe people are using the term *caps* when they really mean *initial caps* or as Word has it, Title Case. This can be very confusing in instructions. Apparently in indexing all caps are seldom used except in legal indexes. Jean ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 19:26:55 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Carol Kennedy Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. -----Original Message----- From: Kim Harris colfaxgp@MINN.NET >writes: My lawyer husband has found that indexes created by people with law degrees > but no actual experience in doing law are often unhelpful to working > lawyers. > Who does he suggest would be the 'best' person to do a law index? Someone >qualified in chemistry? No, me! An intelligent, generally well-educated person with a lifelong interest in law, a familiarity with the terminology, a grasp of the concepts, and a talent for indexing. Carol Kennedy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 19:29:20 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Carol Kennedy Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. -----Original Message----- From: Kim Harris >Still, if I >was a medical practitioner, I'd prefer my textbooks to be indexed by someone >with medical knowledge. How can it be otherwise? "Knowledge" is not solely the possession of those with a degree in a field. As I mentioned before, in copyediting law books (of many kinds), more than once I caught an error of law made by a writer or editor with a law degree--sometimes with a law practice, too. Carol Kennedy ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 21:03:43 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kim Harris Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 03/05/99 01:35:02 GMT Daylight Time, colfaxgp@MINN.NET writes: << "Knowledge" is not solely the possession of those with a degree in a field. As I mentioned before, in copyediting law books (of many kinds), more than once I caught an error of law made by a writer or editor with a law degree--sometimes with a law >> Again, I don't at all dispute what people have said which is similar to the above. What I dislike is the implication in a previous posting (see below) that people with legal qualifications are somehow less suitable to index law texts. << My lawyer husband has found that indexes created by people with law degrees but no actual experience in doing law are often unhelpful to working lawyers. The terminology of theoretical law and practical law is not always the same. >> ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 21:57:43 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: EMickiT@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Hamlet on Errata In a message dated 99-04-30 14:47:10 EDT, you write: << This often is a difficult judgment call. I feel uncomfortable, in conscience, not mentioning something, because I believe that it is unfair not to bring a problem to an editor's attention. On the other hand, a book is so far downstream by the time I get it that it usually is too late to change anything much (or anything at all!). >> I always ask the editor. "Too late" seems to be a relative term, in that the most egregious errors may have to be corrected no matter how much trouble it causes. For example, one history text had the concluding paragraphs of the chapter inserted about 2 pages before the end of the chapter. The editor was grateful I caught it. I make a point of asking the editor during our first phone conversation about the book. I word it, more or less, "IF I find a typo, would you like to be notified?" I use the term "typo" because it seems less threatening, less like I am going to tread on their territory. I can't remember an editor declining the offer. Only one has said to just mark the proofs and send back the appropriate pages. (By his tone of voice, I took it to mean that he was just being polite, but he may have actually had time to check them. It was not a rush job.) Most editors have responded enthusiastically. In that case, I keep my e-mail program open and note typos as I encounter them. Once each day, I send them off. (Of course, some days there is no message to send.) I feel that the earlier they receive a notice of a typo, the better the chance it can be fixed. Only if a mistake is "major-egg-on-the-face" in nature, will I phone them. Otherwise, I feel that an e-mail is less intrusive. They don't need me interrupting their busy day. Erin (Micki) Taylor 785-472-3912 1313 23rd Road Kanopolis, KS 67454 ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 21:37:25 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Michael K. Smith" Subject: Request for outtatown assistance... Hi, all-- I'm presently away from home, responding to a family emergency involving elderly parents, and I'm doing this on my laptop. I'm going to be home in a few days, but then I'll have to be back here again in about a month for another couple of weeks -- which means (sigh...) I shall have to miss the ASI conference in Indianapolis. Ah, well. I didn't happen to bring my conference registration stuff with me, so I can't answer this question: What is the cut-off date for obtaining a refund for the conference fee? (I was going to crash with a friend, so hotel reservations aren't a problem.) If some kind soul could let me know *BY EMAIL* the relevant date (and whether it's a 100% refund, or what), I would be grateful. (And yes, this post ought really to be sent to an individual, but the address book on my laptop seems to be trashed...) Thanks! Michael K. Smith ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 22:59:40 -0400 Reply-To: Kevin Broccoli Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kevin Broccoli Subject: Re: Request for outtatown assistance... Hi Michael, Mentions on the conference info: *All refunds are subject to a 25% processing fee *Full refunds for requests postmarked before 4/1 *50% refunds for requests between 4/1- 5/15 Hope that helps! Kevin Broccoli -----Original Message----- From: Michael K. Smith To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L Date: Sunday, May 02, 1999 10:42 PM Subject: Request for outtatown assistance... >Hi, all-- > >I'm presently away from home, responding to a family emergency involving >elderly parents, and I'm doing this on my laptop. I'm going to be home in a >few days, but then I'll have to be back here again in about a month for >another couple of weeks -- which means (sigh...) I shall have to miss the >ASI conference in Indianapolis. Ah, well. > >I didn't happen to bring my conference registration stuff with me, so I >can't answer this question: What is the cut-off date for obtaining a refund >for the conference fee? (I was going to crash with a friend, so hotel >reservations aren't a problem.) If some kind soul could let me know *BY >EMAIL* the relevant date (and whether it's a 100% refund, or what), I would >be grateful. > >(And yes, this post ought really to be sent to an individual, but the >address book on my laptop seems to be trashed...) > >Thanks! > >Michael K. Smith > ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 23:29:21 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Michael K. Smith" Subject: Not read: Subject area Inquiry eJ8+IhUEAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAFwAAAFJFUE9SVC5J UE0uTm90ZS5JUE5OUk4AtwYBDYAEAAIAAAACAAIAAQqAAQAhAAAARkMzMUU4RjNBNUZERDIxMTk4 RTgwMDYwMDg5RDIxMTIAGgcBA5AGAKwEAAAiAAAACwAjAAAAAAADACYAAAAAAAsAKQAAAAAAAgEx AAEAAAAWAQAAUENERkVCMDkAAQACAHAAAAAAAAAAOKG7EAXlEBqhuwgAKypWwgAARU1TTURCLkRM TAAAAAAAAAAAG1X6IKpmEc2byACqAC/EWgwAAABPU0NBUgAvbz1BT0QgTmV0d29yay9vdT1NU0ov Y249UmVjaXBpZW50cy9jbj1NYXJqIE0ALgAAAAAAAACelczfjuDREZinAGAInSESAQC/MFAxib/R EZh8AGAInSESAAAAARLaAAAAAAAALgAAAAAAAACelczfjuDREZinAGAInSESAQC/MFAxib/REZh8 AGAInSESAAAAARLbAAAQAAAA/DHo86X90hGY6ABgCJ0hEhUAAABTdWJqZWN0IGFyZWEgSW5xdWly eQAAAEAAMgCgpXB8HZW+AQMANgAAAAAAAgFDAAEAAABBAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZnW4A3QEPVAIA AAEATWFyaiBNaXRjaGVsbABTTVRQAG1taXRjaGVsbEBNU0pDT1JQLkNPTQAAAAAeAEQAAQAAAA4A AABNYXJqIE1pdGNoZWxsAAAAHgBJAAEAAAAVAAAAU3ViamVjdCBhcmVhIElucXVpcnkAAAAAAgFM AAEAAABaAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZnW4A3QEPVAIAAAEASW5kZXhlcidzIERpc2N1c3Npb24gR3Jv dXAAU01UUABJTkRFWC1MQEJJTkdWTUIuQ0MuQklOR0hBTVRPTi5FRFUAAAAeAE0AAQAAABsAAABJ bmRleGVyJ3MgRGlzY3Vzc2lvbiBHcm91cAAAQABOAED/jk/Mkb4BQABVAAB9BI7Lkb4BHgBwAAEA AAAVAAAAU3ViamVjdCBhcmVhIElucXVpcnkAAAAAAgFxAAEAAAAbAAAAAb6Ry5otp28Btf1wEdKK sAAQSyL9iQDUeJBkAB4AcgABAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAeAHMAAQAAAAEAAAAAAAAAHgB0AAEAAAAkAAAA TXVsdGlwbGUgcmVjaXBpZW50cyBvZiBsaXN0IElOREVYLUwACwAIDAAAAAACAR0MAQAAABwAAABT TVRQOk1LU01JVEgxQEJFTExTT1VUSC5ORVQACwABDgEAAAALAB8OAQAAAB4AARABAAAAGQAAAE1l c3NhZ2Ugd2FzIG5vdCByZWFkIGJ5OgAAAAADAAYQAAAAAAMABxAAAAAAHgAIEAEAAAAGAAAAfCoO AQQAAAADABAQmPt2AgMAERDkBAAAAgH4DwEAAAAQAAAAsT9yaOXD0RGBCQCgJD0kBwIB+g8BAAAA EAAAALE/cmjlw9ERgQkAoCQ9JAcCAfsPAQAAAFEAAAAAAAAAOKG7EAXlEBqhuwgAKypWwgAAUFNU UFJYLkRMTAAAAAAAAAAATklUQfm/uAEAqgA32W4AAABDOlxXSU5ET1dTXHBlcnNvbmFsLnBzdAAA AAADAP4PBQAAAAMADTT9NwAAAgF/AAEAAAAxAAAAMDAwMDAwMDBCMTNGNzI2OEU1QzNEMTExODEw OTAwQTAyNDNEMjQwNzA0RkYyQzAwAAAAAMMP ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 22:04:59 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Jeri Lee Subject: Re: A Twelve-Step Program for Indexers In-Reply-To: <199905021705.KAA10756@mx1.eskimo.com> --=====================_39944868==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" May I suggest a properly anonymous chat room scheduled for 1:00 a.m. EDT for those pulling all-nighters? Jeri Lee At 01:02 PM 5/2/1999 -0400, you wrote: >Ok, ok. > >Where do we go for the program? The Index-L Clinic for those who chronically >love punishment? >:-) > >Patrick. > --=====================_39944868==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" May I suggest a properly anonymous chat room scheduled for 1:00 a.m. EDT for those pulling all-nighters?

Jeri Lee

At 01:02 PM 5/2/1999 -0400, you wrote:
>Ok, ok.
>
>Where do we go for the program? The Index-L Clinic for those who chronically
>love punishment?
>:-)
>
>Patrick.
>
--=====================_39944868==_.ALT-- ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 22:41:26 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Guy White Subject: Unsubscribe Folks - I've been trying to unsubscribe from this discussion group, but haven't had any luck. Please help me out. I am in your system as one or more of the following: whiteguy@ridgenet.net whiteguy@ridgecrest.ca.us mtimperio@ridgenet.net Thanks... ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 04:46:42 PDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Yves_Fran=E7ois_Jeaurond?= Subject: Charging for Errata in Hamlet In-Reply-To: <199905010009.UAA20903@mag1.magmacom.com> Julie Grayson: May you charge "them" for the work. The editor probably starts sweating every time you send him input. Much encouragement to charge for such things came from William D. Grampp's "Pricing the Priceless: Art, Artists and Economics" (Basic Books, 1989). Sure, the first four or five mistakes are indicated pro bono, at no charge; but why work for free after that? Cordially, Yves Jeaurond jingting@magma.ca ---------- > > Regarding copyediting while indexing: > > When I find a discrepancy, either in composition or text agreement > (i.e., the same name spelled differently or organization titled > differently, etc.), I keep an open e-mail composition and just switch > to it, type in the page location of the error and when I have > accumulated numerous errors, I send it off to the publisher or author. > Right now I'm working with an author and he's VERY happy to have this > input. > > Before the advent of e-mail, I used to send the pages which contained > errors back to the publisher with the hard copy of the index with the > same response. Let's face it, if they don't want to use it or the > schedule doesn't allow for error correction, it's not a problem - > "nothing ventured, nothing gained." But when they do use the > information to their advantage, they are usually very compimentary > regarding my work. > > Julie Grayson > Yves jingting@magma.ca ---------- > > Regarding copyediting while indexing: > > When I find a discrepancy, either in composition or text agreement > (i.e., the same name spelled differently or organization titled > differently, etc.), I keep an open e-mail composition and just switch > to it, type in the page location of the error and when I have > accumulated numerous errors, I send it off to the publisher or author. > Right now I'm working with an author and he's VERY happy to have this > input. > > Before the advent of e-mail, I used to send the pages which contained > errors back to the publisher with the hard copy of the index with the > same response. Let's face it, if they don't want to use it or the > schedule doesn't allow for error correction, it's not a problem - > "nothing ventured, nothing gained." But when they do use the > information to their advantage, they are usually very compimentary > regarding my work. > > Julie Grayson > ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 07:18:39 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: The Welcomes Subject: printers? Hi everyone. I just have a quick question. Being a beginner, and just getting myself set up for indexing, I wondered what kind of printer I'll be needing (laser vs inkjet). Do publisher's have a preference? I currently have an inkjet, but I was wondering if I should be thinking of a laser printer. Or maybe further down the road will I be needing one? OR, does it make a difference at all, since publisher's will want indexes on a disc? Thanks a bunch. Laura ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 08:01:35 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Rachel Rice Subject: crashed my email Hi all, Those garbled messages crashed my email. I had to unsub and resub to Index-L in order to stop it. So I missed a whole bunch of messages. I wondered if anyone had come up with an explanation of what happened? Rachel Rachel Rice Directions Unlimited Desktop Services Indexing, editing, proofreading http://homepages.together.net/~racric racric ICQ 31476947 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 09:33:43 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Debra Lindblom Subject: Re: printers? In a message dated 5/3/99 6:25:39 AM EST, lwelcome@TOGETHER.NET writes: << Hi everyone. I just have a quick question. Being a beginner, and just getting myself set up for indexing, I wondered what kind of printer I'll be needing (laser vs inkjet). Do publisher's have a preference? I currently have an inkjet, but I was wondering if I should be thinking of a laser printer. Or maybe further down the road will I be needing one? OR, does it make a difference at all, since publisher's will want indexes on a disc? Thanks a bunch. Laura >> So far, I have sent all of the indexes by email. Debbie ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 08:39:00 -0600 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "MAB (Borchard, Marj)" Subject: Read: INDEX-L Digest - 27 Apr 1999 to 28 Apr 1999 Your Message To: MAB (Borchard, Marj)(MS:ROI/ROIMN/mab) Entitled: INDEX-L Digest - 27 Apr 1999 to 28 Apr 1999 And Sent On: 1999-04-29 00:01 Was Read At: 1999-05-03 08:38 Priority: C ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ ========================================================================= Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 23:48:23 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Back Words Indexing Subject: New Copyright Info? Does this copyright information apply to indexes, do ya think? >The Berne convention, which the U.S. is signatory to, provides >that >copyright attaches to any work once it is put down in a >fixed medium. >Specific wording is NOT required, the copyright >is automatic. Computer >files do qualify as a fixed medium. >More information about this can be found at > http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html Martha Back Words Indexing ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 16:14:28 +0000 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: c.anderson.seattle@ATT.NET Subject: Re: printers? Except for one holdout (but that's a 650KB+ index file, everything I send now is as an e-mail attachment. Even so, I find it a lot easier to do editing on a printed draft, and if I had a laser, I would use it because of it's cheaper than print cartridges for a DeskJet. Of course, I like having the flexibility of color on the DeskJet for other reasons. Why not get both, use an A/B switch, and deduct both as a business expense? Charles Anderson > In a message dated 5/3/99 6:25:39 AM EST, lwelcome@TOGETHER.NET writes: > > << Hi everyone. I just have a quick question. Being a beginner, and just > getting myself set up for indexing, I wondered what kind of printer I'll be > needing (laser vs inkjet). Do publisher's have a preference? I currently > have an inkjet, but I was wondering if I should be thinking of a laser > printer. Or maybe further down the road will I be needing one? OR, does > it make a difference at all, since publisher's will want indexes on a disc? > > > Thanks a bunch. > Laura >> > > > So far, I have sent all of the indexes by email. > > Debbie ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:36:09 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: JPerlman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: printers? Laura, In my many years of indexing, I've never had the need to produce laser quality printouts. I"d say that 80% of my indexes are sent as email attachments at this point anyway. For the rest, where I'm sending a disk with accompanying printout of the index, the DeskJet does a fine job. The place where it is important to have some kind of decent printer is in printing your marketing materials, business letters, etc. There, appearance counts, so you don't want some kind of sub-standard printer. But again, I find the DeskJet perfectly adequate. I'd say as an initial purchase, the DeskJet is fine. If it turns out that your work and needs point to the laser printer, that can be for later, when you are taking in more cash. Janet Perlman SOUTHWEST INDEXING ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 12:50:19 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: John and Kara Pekar Subject: Re: Even the NY Times... I'm enjoying the recent serge of puns ! I don't mean to be knit-picky, but perhaps Microsoft ought to quilt while they're ahead. They already have a flatlock on the market, darn it! Kara Pekar ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 10:36:16 -0700 Reply-To: indexer@ibm.net Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Sherry L. Smith" Subject: Re: Even the NY Times... What a tangled yarn! Sherry Sherry L Smith INDEXING SERVICES 63505 Bridle Lane Bend, OR 97701 541 382 6414 (voice & fax) indexer@ibm.net ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 13:57:13 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Brian Peck (Research/Library)" Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. >From Patrick; Subject: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 4/30/99 1:15:53 PM Eastern Daylight Time, Brianp@MS.NCGA.STATE.NC.US writes: << It does not take a lawyer to index legal materials any more than it takes a nuclear physicist to index those materials. Knowledge of the language of the subject and some familiarity of the major issues are all that is needed and these can be picked up fairly easily. >> Brian; This is interesting. Are you talking about legal texts, treatises or laws? How did you get up to speed on the legal terminology and keep current on it? Patrick; I got up to speed on legal terminology in a 'baptism of fire'. I was hired as a branch law librarian in Arizona. Our office was in Tucson and the main office was Phoenix. We had no e-mail the first five months I was there, and you can only use the phone so much. I learned the basics real quickly, and over the next 3 years became quite a good legal researcher/librarian (or so my x-boss and the major partners in our office told me). I also had the help of some basic publications on legal research including a great small pocket glossary of legal terminology. This is why indexers have such great reference collections. Daily exposure to researching case law gave me the rest of the substantive ideas and issues. Now I do less legal research but the knowledge of law is applicable in legislative indexing, although I have to balance this with the non-legal users of the index as well. I have never indexed treatises or texts on the law, but feel I could do so competently. Unfortunately, legislation, and legal works, do require a large number of entries per page or, in the case of how I index, per bill. Keeping up is not difficult. Surprisingly the terminology and basic issues change little. The law deals with new issues, as in computer law, by applying old concepts in new ways. Doing legal research is probably a great bonus for keeping up, but if you index legal works with any regularity you can probably keep up to speed pretty well. I think this applies to any field. Yes being a 'degreed' individual in a particular field is a great help to an indexer, but a good indexer can probably pick up enough knowledge to create a good index with not too much preparation. Obviously if you've never been exposed to a subject before you will need more preparation, and above all make sure you have access to good reference tools. Brian M. Peck Technical Librarian/Indexer North Carolina General Assembly brianp@ms.ncga.state.nc.us ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 14:14:13 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Brian Peck (Research/Library)" Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. Kim Harris wrote "Still, if I was a medical practitioner, I'd prefer my textbooks to be indexed by someone with medical knowledge. How can it be otherwise?" True, but medical knowledge, or in the case of the original discussion legal knowledge, does not require a medical/law degree. Are we somehow saying that only engineers can index engineering works, artist art works, historian history works, etc. There is more than one path to knowledge. Our colleges and universities do not have a lock on knowledge (I was tempted to put 'truth' because it sounded better, but it doesn't fit) Brian M. Peck Technical Librarian/Indexer North Carolina General Assembly brianp@ms.ncga.state.nc.us ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:05:54 -0400 Reply-To: Kevin Broccoli Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kevin Broccoli Subject: periodical indexing I've been asked to give an estimate on indexing of a number of years worth of periodicals. I've never indexed periodicals before and was wondering what differences I might encounter in comparison to book indexing. They sent me indexes of their magazine from many years ago. One of the things that I noticed is the indexing is not as deep as the "average" bk index. Also, they use the article names as subentries (I'm not too found of that, but was wondering if it's the norm w/ periodical indexes.) Any ideas? Kevin Broccoli ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:35:44 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Richard Evans Subject: Re: periodical indexing In-Reply-To: <199905031706.ris3vb.h53.37kbi3u@mx10.mindspring.com> At 05:05 PM 5/3/99 -0400, you wrote: >I've been asked to give an estimate on indexing of a number of years worth >of periodicals. I've never indexed periodicals before and was wondering >what differences I might encounter in comparison to book indexing. > >They sent me indexes of their magazine from many years ago. One of the >things that I noticed is the indexing is not as deep as the "average" bk >index. Also, they use the article names as subentries (I'm not too found of >that, but was wondering if it's the norm w/ periodical indexes.) > >Any ideas? Kevin: I want to reiterate my advice to Janet earlier: make sure your client has the wherewithall to do the project before you spend a lot of time on it. Have they indexed this periodical before? Do they have a realistic expectation of what it will cost? Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:51:14 -0400 Reply-To: Kevin Broccoli Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kevin Broccoli Subject: Re: periodical indexing Yes, they've indexed before (see my previous comment below): ">They sent me indexes of their magazine from many years ago. One of the >things that I noticed is the indexing is not as deep as the "average" bk >index. Also, they use the article names as subentries (I'm not too found of >that, but was wondering if it's the norm w/ periodical indexes.)" Pricing I can figure out. What I *really* want to know is mentioned above. While I'm at it...I also noticed pg ranges of many more pgs than should be used in bk indexes. Seems they've been indexing more to article level. Anyone know if that is common in periodical indexing? Kevin -----Original Message----- From: Richard Evans To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L Date: Monday, May 03, 1999 5:41 PM Subject: Re: periodical indexing >At 05:05 PM 5/3/99 -0400, you wrote: >>I've been asked to give an estimate on indexing of a number of years worth >>of periodicals. I've never indexed periodicals before and was wondering >>what differences I might encounter in comparison to book indexing. >> >>They sent me indexes of their magazine from many years ago. One of the >>things that I noticed is the indexing is not as deep as the "average" bk >>index. Also, they use the article names as subentries (I'm not too found of >>that, but was wondering if it's the norm w/ periodical indexes.) >> >>Any ideas? > >Kevin: > >I want to reiterate my advice to Janet earlier: make sure your client has >the wherewithall to do the project before you spend a lot of time on it. > >Have they indexed this periodical before? Do they have a realistic >expectation of what it will cost? > >Dick ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 17:57:14 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Rachel Rice Subject: job ops for copyediting/proofreading Hey all, Just aquired a new client who's looking for freelance copyeditors and proofreaders. I have no idea yet how good a company it is to work for. My contact had some rather archaic ideas about indexing (gave me an spec sheet that including a brief paragraph on how to fill out your index cards, and more along those lines). The pay for indexing is poor but I have taken an assignment anyway hoping things will get better. It's hard to resist a possibility of occas. work right here in town. If they are slow payers, though, forget it. They prefer local people (Brattleboro, VT) but will consider people from elsewhere. They want ONLY experienced people. They are not publishers, but rather full service packagers, but not just someone with a sole business. They have a big building with regular employees and a picnic table, and have about 200 books going at any given time. If you want to find out more, send email/resumes not to me or to the list but to Judy Ashkenaz at judya@stratfordpublishing.com They also have a website. If someone gets work from them, I'd love to know. Good luck! Rachel Rachel Rice Directions Unlimited Desktop Services Indexing, editing, proofreading http://homepages.together.net/~racric racric ICQ 31476947 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 18:28:08 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Guy White Subject: Re: Unsubscribe In-Reply-To: Already tried the "appropriate" way, and, like I said, I haven't had any luck. My ISP did something to my e-mail account (after I subscribed to your list) that prevents me from unsubscribing the "appropriate" way. I need manual intervention. Any help out there? -----Original Message----- From: J. Naomi Linzer [mailto:jnlinzer@saber.net] Sent: Monday, May 03, 1999 9:40 AM To: whiteguy@ridgenet.net Subject: Re: Unsubscribe >Folks - > >I've been trying to unsubscribe from this discussion group, but haven't had >any luck. Please help me out. I am in your system as one or more of the >following: > >whiteguy@ridgenet.net >whiteguy@ridgecrest.ca.us >mtimperio@ridgenet.net > >Thanks... Check out the appropriate site listed below. Naomi **************************************************************************** *J. J. Naomi Linzer Indexing Services POB 1341 Redway, CA 95560 (707) 923-4361 jnlinzer@saber.net **************************************************************************** ** http://www.asindexing.org <-- American Society of Indexers website. http://www.onelist.com/archives.cgi/indexstudents <--Indexing students e-mail-list. http://www.indexpup.com/index-list/FAQ <--Index-L e-mail list FAQS. ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 18:31:04 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sonsie Conroy Subject: Re: New Copyright Info? At 11:48 PM 5/2/1999 -0700, Back Words Indexing wrote: >Does this copyright information apply to indexes, do ya think? > >>The Berne convention, which the U.S. is signatory to, provides >that >>copyright attaches to any work once it is put down in a >fixed medium. >>Specific wording is NOT required, the copyright >is automatic. Computer >>files do qualify as a fixed medium. >>More information about this can be found at >> http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html Well, it's not "new," as that's been the rule for X number of years (past 1976, I think). And yes, it technically does apply to indexes, but as we've discussed before, it's unlikely that your ownership of the copyright on your index is going to do you a bit of good. First, if you have signed a contract for hire, the copyright is owned by whoever is paying you. If you haven't signed such a contract, you do own the copyright on your index, but it's virtually useless without the book it is attached to. Sonsie sconroy@slonet.org ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 3 May 1999 20:52:04 PDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Manjit Sahai Subject: ASI Conf. Worshops Hi everyone, I was planning to attend *Open/Closed indexing* workshop at Indy conf. But that has been cancelled and replaced with some kind of workshop to be given by Enid. I am not too crazy for that workshop. I am thinking about attending *Thesaurus Development* workshop. So my questions are...... 1...Has anyone from Index-L attended Thesaurus developemnt conf. in the past? Did you get any benefit from that conf.? 2...what type of indexers are the *best* candidates for attending that conf.? (Basically, I do indexes for books. I am trying to break into periodical indexing, but so far no luck). 3...what type of indexers use thesaurus for indexing? Are they book indexers or periodical or database indexers? 4...Is there any particular type of subject where thesaurus is developed for creating indexes? Some of my questions may sound very stupid, but to be honest, my knowledge about thesaurus is almost zero. The only thesaurus I have at home is.....*Roget's Super Thesaurus*. I would appreciate a quick reply so that I can decide which workshop to attend. Thanks in advance. Manjit K. Sahai RAM Indexing Services _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 06:12:51 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kim Harris Subject: Re: Non-lawyers & Legal Indexes. In a message dated 03/05/99 19:15:19 GMT Daylight Time, Brianp@MS.NCGA.STATE.NC.US writes: << Are we somehow saying that only engineers can index engineering works, artist art works, historian history works, etc. >> No, but all other things, being equal, I think that detailed subject knowledge would be a bonus. kim ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:01:59 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sharon Hughes Subject: Re: periodical indexing In a message dated 99-05-03 17:53:41 EDT, brocindx@IN4WEB.COM writes: << Pricing I can figure out. What I *really* want to know is mentioned above. >> Perdiodical indexing is different from back of the book indexing. Basically you copy the style and depth of indexing that was used in the previous year's index. The styles can be very different from periodical to periodical. In the great majority of cases, you are indexing the article itself not exactly the content of the article. You want to help the searcher find an article and you index the metatopic. I usually index between 3 and 5 headings that would bring the reader to look up the article. Author's keywords are not generally helpful because they often don't get the idea and are either too broad or seem to be wishful thinking. The formating of subentries is also varied. I've been asked to use every thing from the whole title of the article plus authors as a subhead down to no subs at all. Once again the page format is variable. It may include the volume number, it may list only the first page of the article, or it may give the page range for the article. My best advice, is that if the publisher was happy with the previous index follow it like a cookbook. If not, prepare a sample of two or three formats and let them choose one. Other periodicals in the same field may be used as a guide because different specialties use different styles. Good luck, Sharon ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:29:01 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Susan Weiss Subject: Re: ASI Conf. Worshops - thesaurus workshop I work for a publisher that has a thesaurus. We find the thesaurus useful for indexing periodicals because the same subject matter is included in most of our periodicals. We generally don't use the thesaurus for indexing books because the books tend to be on much narrower topics. Sue Weiss Tax Analysts Arlington, VA. Manjit Sahai on 05/03/99 11:52:04 PM Please respond to Indexer's Discussion Group To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L cc: Subject: ASI Conf. Worshops Hi everyone, I was planning to attend *Open/Closed indexing* workshop at Indy conf. But that has been cancelled and replaced with some kind of workshop to be given by Enid. I am not too crazy for that workshop. I am thinking about attending *Thesaurus Development* workshop. So my questions are...... 1...Has anyone from Index-L attended Thesaurus developemnt conf. in the past? Did you get any benefit from that conf.? 2...what type of indexers are the *best* candidates for attending that conf.? (Basically, I do indexes for books. I am trying to break into periodical indexing, but so far no luck). 3...what type of indexers use thesaurus for indexing? Are they book indexers or periodical or database indexers? 4...Is there any particular type of subject where thesaurus is developed for creating indexes? Some of my questions may sound very stupid, but to be honest, my knowledge about thesaurus is almost zero. The only thesaurus I have at home is.....*Roget's Super Thesaurus*. I would appreciate a quick reply so that I can decide which workshop to attend. Thanks in advance. Manjit K. Sahai RAM Indexing Services _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:37:58 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Susan Weiss Subject: Re: periodical indexing I index periodicals. I generally use 1-5 subject entries per article. For the subject indexes, we use a thesaurus. We use only the first page number as the locator. Sharon Hughes on 05/04/99 09:01:59 AM Please respond to Indexer's Discussion Group To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L cc: Subject: Re: periodical indexing In a message dated 99-05-03 17:53:41 EDT, brocindx@IN4WEB.COM writes: << Pricing I can figure out. What I *really* want to know is mentioned above. >> Perdiodical indexing is different from back of the book indexing. Basically you copy the style and depth of indexing that was used in the previous year's index. The styles can be very different from periodical to periodical. In the great majority of cases, you are indexing the article itself not exactly the content of the article. You want to help the searcher find an article and you index the metatopic. I usually index between 3 and 5 headings that would bring the reader to look up the article. Author's keywords are not generally helpful because they often don't get the idea and are either too broad or seem to be wishful thinking. The formating of subentries is also varied. I've been asked to use every thing from the whole title of the article plus authors as a subhead down to no subs at all. Once again the page format is variable. It may include the volume number, it may list only the first page of the article, or it may give the page range for the article. My best advice, is that if the publisher was happy with the previous index follow it like a cookbook. If not, prepare a sample of two or three formats and let them choose one. Other periodicals in the same field may be used as a guide because different specialties use different styles. Good luck, Sharon ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:42:43 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: JPerlman@AOL.COM Subject: Re: periodical indexing Kevin, I've found that the periodical clients I have want more of a "keyword" index than an in depth index. They want to index the title (common!) under 4 or 5 or 6 main headings and that's it. They don't expect me to read the articles in their entirety and pick out entries from within the articles, and they don't expect to pay for that kind of in-depth indexing. If you figure your time (and your bid) that way, it takes a lot less time, and you can keep your bid down. Just be sure that that is what they want before you low-bid that way. I find myself able to do about 5 articles per hour that way, figuring thinking time, flipping pages time, data entry time, etc. It's kind of a quick and dirty. But as I said, be sure the client wants that type of index. As for pages, my clients want only the first page, not the page range. First page of the article. This keeps the time down as well -- less searching for things, and easier data entry. Hope this helps! Janet Perlman SOUTHWEST INDEXING ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:47:52 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Charlotte Skuster Organization: Binghamton University Subject: [Fwd: Fwd: Indexing a history periodical] This was forwarded from Bonnie Parks-Davies at the ASI Office. Please do not reply to the list, but to "Germano G. Streese" >Date: Mon, 03 May 1999 14:53:23 -0300 >From: "Germano G. Streese" >Reply-To: biblioteca@est.com.br >Organization: Escola Superior de Teologia >X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.5 [en] (Win95; I) >X-Accept-Language: en >To: info@ASIndexing.org >Subject: Indexing a history periodical > >Dear Sir or Madam: > >I received today an inquiry of a professor who is the editor of a >journal on the=A0 on the field of history that is published in Brazil. T= he >languages of the articles are Portuguese and Spanish. Occasionally also >English and German is used. They also published a small abstract and >furnish 5 key word for indexing. He is looking for places where he could >send the journal to be eventually indexed. Could you be so kind and send >me any information about it. > >You can send information to the following e-mail: biblioteca@est.com.br > >In advance I am grateful for all your attention: > >Germano G. Streese - Librarian >Escola Superior de Teologia >Caixa Postal 14 >93001-970 S=E3o Leopoldo, RS - Brazil > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 10:03:07 -0400 Reply-To: Kevin Broccoli Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Kevin Broccoli Subject: periodical indexing- thanks! Thanks for all of the extremely helpful responses (both on and off-list) to my questions regarding periodical indexing. What a big help you all are! Kevin Broccoli ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:45:37 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Laura M. Gottlieb" Subject: Periodical indexing 4 May 1999 Dear Kevin, Periodical indexing, in my experience, is quite different from book indexing in that the indexer only indexes "the big picture"--the *general* contents of each article, rather than the specific contents that you would index for a book. You're trying to give access to the main points of the article, rather than the details. Generally, only 5-10 subjects need to be indexed for each article, and most of those subjects come from the contents of the title, an abstract of the article, or a quick perusual of the article itself. The author's name(s) is also important. I liken periodical indexing in my own mind to library cataloging in which access is given only to the general contents of the whole book; individual chapters on different individuals, specific poems or short stories, etc. are not generally catalogued. For example, for a book which contains a number of short biographies of famous American scientists, the subject heading would be something like "Scientists-- American," but it's unlikely that each scientist discussed would be catalogued. Another striking difference between back-of-the-book indexing and periodical indexing has to do with vocabulary control. It's always likely that indexes to a periodical will need to be cumulated at some time, so it's important to use the same subject headings over the years. It sounds as though your particular periodical has already been indexed in the past. I would start by obtaining (or even making) a list of the subject headings already used so that you could add the new material to them. And, as you add new headings of your own, I would add them to that list. Keeping up with cross-references over the years is also important. It can be helpful to use a thesaurus for the field or even something like SEARS' LIST OF SUBJECT HEADINGS to keep vocabulary from drifting. About using article titles as a heading or subheading: I wouldn't. Most titles are completely forgettable and some don't even hint at what the subject is. They also tend to be lengthy. I think people mostly try to access information by subject or by author. It's helpful if you can get some guidelines from the periodical's editors about what they want to see in the index, too. This is just my 2 cents worth. I've only indexed two periodicals. Perhaps other periodical indexers have other advice and approaches.--Laura Moss Gottlieb, Freelance Indexer ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 10:04:13 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was maryann@ITASCA.REVISOR.LEG.STATE.MN.US From: Maryann Corbett Organization: Revisor of Statutes Subject: periodical work--how to get it? I've been saving posts about periodical indexing for a some time now, and I have another question to raise: How does one seek work in periodical indexing? A lot of our work happens by luck and chance, but is there standard advice on marketing for periodical work that is different from the advice on marketing for back-of-the book? Does the advice for finding periodical work also go for finding database work? -- Maryann Corbett Language Specialist Office of the Revisor of Statutes Minnesota Legislature 651-297-2952 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 08:06:44 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Aganita Varkentine (S&T Onsite)" Subject: Re: Periodical indexing Are there any periodical indexers from Information Access Co. in Foster City, CA on this list? (At least it used to be called that) I worked there from 1978-1994. ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:06:30 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: The Welcomes Subject: Thanks! Hey, thanks to those who gave me some advice on the printer situation. And thanks for catching my apostrophe error (publisher's, publishers', publishers?). It's usually, only that pesky, comma, what gives me so much, trou,ble! Sincerely,,,,,,, Laura ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:45:05 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: JPerlman@AOL.COM Subject: periodical work--how to get it? Maryann, I've gotten my periodical work by going after it, rather than by chance, where somebody found me. I think a lot of people involved in journal production don't have a clue where to find an indexer or who to hire. It is a wide open field, IMHO. You get your name and CVs to them and you'll have results, I think. My strategy (soon to be used again), is to get my resume (or brochure, or whatever you use) into the hands of organizations publishing in your fields of interest and/or expertise. Use whatever means you need to to get the names of these professional organizations. You can use Literary Market Place, or you can do what I did. I did a web search on subject specialty areas in my fields of interest, to find names of organizations. Often the website has a "publications" area, and you can find the name of the editor or production manager there. Then I send my marketing materials. Perhaps library research will reveal the same information, if you have a university or excellent big-city library at your disposal. If not, the LMP or web search method will work. When I searched on the web, I tried to search on limited subspecialties, so as not to get 100,000 hits back. So, for instance, I searched for "polymer chemistry" or "polymer engineering" or "chemical engineering", rather than "chemistry" or "engineering". It may take multiple searches, such as "polymer chemistry" and "plastics chemistry" and "plastics engineering" to ferret out all there is in one area. You get the idea. One last mention ... many if not most of these journals are handled by outside sources to do their production work. It is most likely that you will hear from those folks re indexing, rather than from the organization itself. What happened in my case was that the journal folks at the professional organization had my resume and told the production people to get me to do the work, as I had the background for it. It was a good way to get a foot in the door. Good luck! The work is out there. Janet Perlman SOUTHWEST INDEXING ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 12:37:34 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Szews, Susan K." Subject: QUERY: company beginnning indexing program Hi all - I've been lurking for quite some time now, trying to get as much information as I can about indexing before trying to index our hardware/software user manuals for our company. I've made a sample index that has passed muster with our editor, but we still have a few questions: 1. Our manuals are in landscape format with 8 1/2 X 11 pages. Does anyone out here do indexes in this format? 2. We are doing our indexes in Interleaf using their embedding tool. Does anyone have any experience with this as well, who can perhaps give us any warnings about pitfalls or bugs? Heck, if anyone with experience with embedded indexing has horror stories, we would love to hear those too! 3. Is it better for the individual manual writers to do their own indexes, or should we look at assigning one or two people to do the indexes after the manuals are completed? Unfortunately, we don't have time to take any classes. I've read the Chicago Manual of Style, and since I am detailed-oriented, I think I did pretty well on my sample index, but I'm still pretty worried about this project. Any advice or stories would be welcomed! Thanks in advance - Susan Szews Senior Technical Writer/Illustrator Bell & Howell Mail Messaging and Technologies ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:28:02 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Roberta Horowitz Subject: Re: periodical work--how to get it? In-Reply-To: <199905041545.LAA50716@mail.acm.org> Snip --- My strategy (soon to be used again), is to get my resume (or brochure, or whatever you use) into the hands of organizations publishing in your fields of interest and/or expertise. Use whatever means you need to to get the names of these professional organizations. You can use Literary Market Place, or you can do what I did. I did a web search on subject specialty areas in my fields of interest, to find names of organizations. Often the website has a "publications" area, and you can find the name of the editor or production manager there. Then I send my marketing materials. There is a book out there that used to be called Gale's Directory of Associations -- it is 3 volumes arranged by subject and a couple of other ways. Most libraries have a copy Roberta Horowitz rhorowitz@acm.org ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 13:38:30 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Roberta Horowitz Subject: Re: Periodical indexing In-Reply-To: <199905041450.KAA115336@mail.acm.org> Snip --- About using article titles as a heading or subheading: I wouldn't. Most titles are completely forgettable and some don't even hint at what the subject is For medical works, the title is usually on target and from my work in a medical library, many of the patrons would ask for an article using a partial title. In many of the periodicals I deal with the title is indexed but put in bold so it stands out. Roberta Horowitz rhorowitz@acm.org ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 09:15:51 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Rachel Rice Subject: copyrights and samples In-Reply-To: <92578130801@voyager.together.net> This copyright ownership thing came up at the Mass. Society of Indexers meeting in the context of putting samples of your work on your web site, or for that matter, sending samples to potential clients. I doubt anyone would come after me, but I would like to know if it is a copyright infringement to do so. Anyone? Rae Rachel Rice Directions Unlimited Desktop Services Indexing, editing, proofreading http://homepages.together.net/~racric racric ICQ 31476947 ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 10:57:18 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Jan C. Wright" Subject: Re: QUERY: company beginnning indexing program In-Reply-To: <199905041239.riu8lt.3kr.37kbi17@mx9.mindspring.com> Landscape format simply will mean more columns (but shorter) on each page. Make sure you check the ragging and rollover lines to be sure you are using the best font size and spacing for the format. You want it to be easy to read, and to not have a lot of unnecessary rollover lines, which make the indenting hard to decipher. I have never done any interleaf - would love to hear from someone has done it. In technical writing, opinions are split on who does the best indexing for a manual, the writer, or someone else assigned to do it afterwards. I usually feel that the writer can generate a ton of good information and alternate terms, but often is too close to the material (and too burned out on it) to really be able to step back and look at it from the reader's viewpoint. So someone else is often a good choice - bring fresh eyes to the material. You can often have writers put in ideas for entries as they work, but some professional indexers find those a hindrance, as you have to stop, change focus, and evaluate each one, instead of getting a fresh view of each page. So it is divided opinion.... Jan Wright At 12:37 PM 5/4/99 -0400, you wrote: >Hi all - > >I've been lurking for quite some time now, trying to get as much information >as I can about indexing before trying to index our hardware/software user >manuals for our company. > >I've made a sample index that has passed muster with our editor, but we >still have a few questions: > >1. Our manuals are in landscape format with 8 1/2 X 11 pages. Does anyone >out here do indexes in this format? > >2. We are doing our indexes in Interleaf using their embedding tool. Does >anyone have any experience with this as well, who can perhaps give us any >warnings about pitfalls or bugs? Heck, if anyone with experience with >embedded indexing has horror stories, we would love to hear those too! > >3. Is it better for the individual manual writers to do their own indexes, >or should we look at assigning one or two people to do the indexes after the >manuals are completed? > >Unfortunately, we don't have time to take any classes. I've read the >Chicago Manual of Style, and since I am detailed-oriented, I think I did >pretty well on my sample index, but I'm still pretty worried about this >project. > >Any advice or stories would be welcomed! > >Thanks in advance - >Susan Szews >Senior Technical Writer/Illustrator >Bell & Howell Mail Messaging and Technologies =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= Wright Information Indexing Services http://www.wrightinformation.com Jancw@wrightinformation.com =+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+=+= ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:26:50 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sonsie Conroy Subject: Re: copyrights and samples At 09:15 AM 5/4/1999 -0400, Rachel Rice wrote: >This copyright ownership thing came up at the Mass. Society of Indexers >meeting in the context of putting samples of your work on your web site, or >for that matter, sending samples to potential clients. I doubt anyone would >come after me, but I would like to know if it is a copyright infringement >to do so. Anyone? Rae, if you haven't signed a work-for-hire contract, then YOU own the copyright and can do with it what you please. If you've signed one of those contracts, technically the publisher owns the index and if you are being a real perfectionist, you would write the company and request permission to use the index as a sample. However, as you say, it is extremely unlikely that anybody is going to come after you for "misusing" their index on your website. In the contracts I prepare for graphic design and copywriting, I always put a clause in there to the effect that notwithstanding any other copyright ownership statement, I have the right to use my work in my portfolio as a sample. I've yet to have anybody complain about this, or try to argue me out of it. I don't bother with this sort of thing when I do indexing, because I rarely have a formal contract and I've also never had any problem with showing my work in a sample context. Sonsie sconroy@slonet.org ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 11:37:11 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group Comments: Warning -- original Sender: tag was SBlaeser@REGI.UBC.CA From: Stephen Blaeser Subject: Not read: Subject area Inquiry Your message To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L Subject: Subject area Inquiry Sent: Wed, 28 Apr 1999 16:10:30 -0700 was not read ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:18:40 +1200 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Marite Tweeddale Subject: Modifying existing existing index Dear Group I have recently been approached by 3 legal anccounting publishers who want their voluminous looseleaf services reindexed. In all cases these services have not had the index updated for between 18 months and 3 years. These looseleafs are between three and five volumes in size and average around 6-7,000 pages. If I can get the filing sheets I can go through from the first update to the last and insert the new terms into the existing index. My problems are as follows: 1. With looseleafs, sometimes big chunks are thrown out & replaced with nothing. The terms within these pages need to be removed from the index to maintian its integrity. Noone, knows now what was on these pages. 2. How will I charge for this work? Anyway I look at it it will cost so much that the publisher will balk. Looked at logically, though when divided by 3 years the cost is not that astronomical. 3. How long would people estimate such large jobs should take. In each case the publisher has wanted this done in 3-4 weeks. I think this is impossible. What does the group think about and taking on and negotiating projects such as these? Is there a simple way around this that I haven't thought of. In each instance I have said I'd take the project on but because my quotes have been so high I have heard nothing so far. All suggestions would be very welcome. Thanks in advance Marite Marite Tweeddale Precis, Information & Knowledge Management Services 136 Onslow Road, Wellington 4, New Zealand Tel. 00 64 4 479 6798 email: marite@paradise.net.nz ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:57:34 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: D Borasky Subject: contacting publishers Hello, I'm new to indexing and have a question about contacting publishers. I've seen a few posts to the list about mailing your marketing materials to publishers - do you address it to a specific position title (i.e. "Dear Editor")? I imagine this would help get your materials to the right person, but who would that typically be? Is this "cold mailing" really the best way to break into the field? Thanks! D. Borasky ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:57:43 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Wright, Sharon F." Subject: Re: Modifying existing existing index I really think that this is a case where the cheapest, best option would be to reindex from scratch. If you have the current index in a numeric view and all of the current pages it would be POSSIBLE to update these indexes, but frankly, the time you would spend figuring out whether the existing index entries are good, bad or renumbered could better be spent just reindexing the whole thing. No, it won't be cheap, but you could negotiate with them the depth of indexing that they want and adjust your price accordingly. Good luck! -- Sharon W. Sharon.Wright@Lexis-Nexis.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Marite Tweeddale [SMTP:marite@PARADISE.NET.NZ] > Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 4:19 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L > Subject: Modifying existing existing index > > Dear Group > > I have recently been approached by 3 legal anccounting publishers who want > their voluminous looseleaf services reindexed. > > In all cases these services have not had the index updated for between 18 > months and 3 years. > > These looseleafs are between three and five volumes in size and average > around 6-7,000 pages. > > If I can get the filing sheets I can go through from the first update to > the > last and insert the new terms into the existing index. > > My problems are as follows: > > 1. With looseleafs, sometimes big chunks are thrown out & replaced with > nothing. The terms within these pages need to be removed from the index > to > maintian its integrity. Noone, knows now what was on these pages. > > 2. How will I charge for this work? Anyway I look at it it will cost so > much that the publisher will balk. Looked at logically, though when > divided > by 3 years the cost is not that astronomical. > > 3. How long would people estimate such large jobs should take. In each > case the publisher has wanted this done in 3-4 weeks. I think this is > impossible. > > What does the group think about and taking on and negotiating projects > such > as these? > > Is there a simple way around this that I haven't thought of. In each > instance I have said I'd take the project on but because my quotes have > been > so high I have heard nothing so far. > > All suggestions would be very welcome. > > Thanks in advance > > Marite > > > > > > Marite Tweeddale > Precis, Information & Knowledge Management Services > 136 Onslow Road, Wellington 4, New Zealand > Tel. 00 64 4 479 6798 > email: marite@paradise.net.nz ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 16:45:18 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Wanda Harding Subject: Re: ASI Conf. Worshops - thesaurus workshop Is my understanding correct? the thesaurus you refer to is like a style guide? Wanda Susan Weiss wrote: > I work for a publisher that has a thesaurus. We find the thesaurus useful for > indexing periodicals because the same subject matter is included in most of our > periodicals. We generally don't use the thesaurus for indexing books because > the books tend to be on much narrower topics. > > Sue Weiss > Tax Analysts > Arlington, VA. > > Manjit Sahai on 05/03/99 11:52:04 PM > > Please respond to Indexer's Discussion Group > > To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L > cc: > Subject: ASI Conf. Worshops > > Hi everyone, > > I was planning to attend *Open/Closed indexing* workshop at Indy conf. But > that has been cancelled and replaced with some kind of workshop to be given > by Enid. I am not too crazy for that workshop. I am thinking about attending > *Thesaurus Development* workshop. So my questions are...... > > 1...Has anyone from Index-L attended Thesaurus developemnt conf. in the > past? Did you get any benefit from that conf.? > > 2...what type of indexers are the *best* candidates for attending that > conf.? (Basically, I do indexes for books. I am trying to break into > periodical indexing, but so far no luck). > > 3...what type of indexers use thesaurus for indexing? Are they book indexers > or periodical or database indexers? > > 4...Is there any particular type of subject where thesaurus is developed for > creating indexes? > > Some of my questions may sound very stupid, but to be honest, my knowledge > about thesaurus is almost zero. The only thesaurus I have at home > is.....*Roget's Super Thesaurus*. > > I would appreciate a quick reply so that I can decide which workshop to > attend. Thanks in advance. > > Manjit K. Sahai > RAM Indexing Services > > _______________________________________________________________ > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 14:14:52 +0000 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sylvia Coates Subject: Re: contacting publishers You need to contact the production editor. Call up the publisher and ask for the name of the production editor who is in charge of hiring indexers. That will the person you need to address. Best, Sylvia Coates D Borasky wrote: > Hello, > I'm new to indexing and have a question about contacting publishers. I've seen > a > few posts to the list about mailing your marketing materials to publishers - do > you address it to a specific position title (i.e. "Dear Editor")? I imagine > this > would help get your materials to the right person, but who would that typically > be? Is this "cold mailing" really the best way to break into the field? > Thanks! > D. Borasky ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 17:37:57 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Keith McQuay Subject: Re: Modifying existing existing index Wow. Quite a job! I would just like to add that I'll bet the publisher would love it if you could set up some system for them to update the index in the future as they go along. Keith McQuay Foreword Indexing Services 613-634-2669 Foreword.pair.com ---------- >From: Marite Tweeddale >To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L >Subject: Modifying existing existing index >Date: Tue, May 4, 1999, 4:18 PM > >Dear Group > >I have recently been approached by 3 legal anccounting publishers who want >their voluminous looseleaf services reindexed. > >In all cases these services have not had the index updated for between 18 >months and 3 years. > >These looseleafs are between three and five volumes in size and average >around 6-7,000 pages. > >If I can get the filing sheets I can go through from the first update to the >last and insert the new terms into the existing index. > >My problems are as follows: > >1. With looseleafs, sometimes big chunks are thrown out & replaced with >nothing. The terms within these pages need to be removed from the index to >maintian its integrity. Noone, knows now what was on these pages. > >2. How will I charge for this work? Anyway I look at it it will cost so >much that the publisher will balk. Looked at logically, though when divided >by 3 years the cost is not that astronomical. > >3. How long would people estimate such large jobs should take. In each >case the publisher has wanted this done in 3-4 weeks. I think this is >impossible. > >What does the group think about and taking on and negotiating projects such >as these? > >Is there a simple way around this that I haven't thought of. In each >instance I have said I'd take the project on but because my quotes have been >so high I have heard nothing so far. > >All suggestions would be very welcome. > >Thanks in advance > >Marite > > > > > >Marite Tweeddale >Precis, Information & Knowledge Management Services >136 Onslow Road, Wellington 4, New Zealand >Tel. 00 64 4 479 6798 >email: marite@paradise.net.nz > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 18:12:53 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: User8 Subject: Re: Modifying existing existing index Fortunately, or unfortunately, this is a case where embedded indexing would best serve the client's needs, so that in future revisions, deleted text would take it's index entries with it, and the index entries would travel with the text if it were moved. The issue will be what software is currently being used to prepare the text, and does it have anything useful that would allow embedding? This of course does not address the issue of indexing style should another indexer work on this project in later years, but if the publisher were on the ball, it would be clear that this is the way to go. While the initial cost would be high, since you would re-index the whole thing, in future years it would clearly pay off. Iris Ailin-Pyzik Marite Tweeddale wrote: > > Dear Group > > I have recently been approached by 3 legal anccounting publishers who want > their voluminous looseleaf services reindexed. > > In all cases these services have not had the index updated for between 18 > months and 3 years. > > These looseleafs are between three and five volumes in size and average > around 6-7,000 pages. > > If I can get the filing sheets I can go through from the first update to the > last and insert the new terms into the existing index. > > My problems are as follows: > > 1. With looseleafs, sometimes big chunks are thrown out & replaced with > nothing. The terms within these pages need to be removed from the index to > maintian its integrity. Noone, knows now what was on these pages. > > 2. How will I charge for this work? Anyway I look at it it will cost so > much that the publisher will balk. Looked at logically, though when divided > by 3 years the cost is not that astronomical. > > 3. How long would people estimate such large jobs should take. In each > case the publisher has wanted this done in 3-4 weeks. I think this is > impossible. > > What does the group think about and taking on and negotiating projects such > as these? > > Is there a simple way around this that I haven't thought of. In each > instance I have said I'd take the project on but because my quotes have been > so high I have heard nothing so far. > > All suggestions would be very welcome. > > Thanks in advance > > Marite > > Marite Tweeddale > Precis, Information & Knowledge Management Services > 136 Onslow Road, Wellington 4, New Zealand > Tel. 00 64 4 479 6798 > email: marite@paradise.net.nz ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:44:33 +1000 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Ralph REID Subject: Re: Modifying existing existing index Hello Marite Tell the publisher to get a DECENT package like Framemaker which will allow an index to be set up and maintained on any number of individual files (documents) that can act as stand-alone documents if required and at the same time be linked together for indexing purposes. Framemaker is my package of choice for all advanced publishing tasks. Regards Ralph Reid Sydney Australia -----Original Message----- From: User8 To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L Date: Wednesday, 5 May 1999 8:15 AM Subject: Re: Modifying existing existing index >Fortunately, or unfortunately, this is a case where embedded indexing >would best serve the client's needs, so that in future revisions, >deleted text would take it's index entries with it, and the index >entries would travel with the text if it were moved. The issue will be >what software is currently being used to prepare the text, and does it >have anything useful that would allow embedding? >This of course does not address the issue of indexing style should >another indexer work on this project in later years, but if the >publisher were on the ball, it would be clear that this is the way to >go. While the initial cost would be high, since you would re-index the >whole thing, in future years it would clearly pay off. > >Iris Ailin-Pyzik > >Marite Tweeddale wrote: >> >> Dear Group >> >> I have recently been approached by 3 legal anccounting publishers who want >> their voluminous looseleaf services reindexed. >> >> In all cases these services have not had the index updated for between 18 >> months and 3 years. >> >> These looseleafs are between three and five volumes in size and average >> around 6-7,000 pages. >> >> If I can get the filing sheets I can go through from the first update to the >> last and insert the new terms into the existing index. >> >> My problems are as follows: >> >> 1. With looseleafs, sometimes big chunks are thrown out & replaced with >> nothing. The terms within these pages need to be removed from the index to >> maintian its integrity. Noone, knows now what was on these pages. >> >> 2. How will I charge for this work? Anyway I look at it it will cost so >> much that the publisher will balk. Looked at logically, though when divided >> by 3 years the cost is not that astronomical. >> >> 3. How long would people estimate such large jobs should take. In each >> case the publisher has wanted this done in 3-4 weeks. I think this is >> impossible. >> >> What does the group think about and taking on and negotiating projects such >> as these? >> >> Is there a simple way around this that I haven't thought of. In each >> instance I have said I'd take the project on but because my quotes have been >> so high I have heard nothing so far. >> >> All suggestions would be very welcome. >> >> Thanks in advance >> >> Marite >> >> Marite Tweeddale >> Precis, Information & Knowledge Management Services >> 136 Onslow Road, Wellington 4, New Zealand >> Tel. 00 64 4 479 6798 >> email: marite@paradise.net.nz > ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 20:38:39 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Susan Weiss Subject: Re: ASI Conf. Worshops - thesaurus workshop No, the it's not at all like a style guide. It's a thesaurus. Sue Weiss Tax Analysts Wanda Harding on 05/04/99 04:45:18 PM Please respond to "Indexer's Discussion Group" To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L cc: Subject: Re: ASI Conf. Worshops - thesaurus workshop Is my understanding correct? the thesaurus you refer to is like a style guide? Wanda Susan Weiss wrote: > I work for a publisher that has a thesaurus. We find the thesaurus useful for > indexing periodicals because the same subject matter is included in most of our > periodicals. We generally don't use the thesaurus for indexing books because > the books tend to be on much narrower topics. > > Sue Weiss > Tax Analysts > Arlington, VA. > > Manjit Sahai on 05/03/99 11:52:04 PM > > Please respond to Indexer's Discussion Group > > To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L > cc: > Subject: ASI Conf. Worshops > > Hi everyone, > > I was planning to attend *Open/Closed indexing* workshop at Indy conf. But > that has been cancelled and replaced with some kind of workshop to be given > by Enid. I am not too crazy for that workshop. I am thinking about attending > *Thesaurus Development* workshop. So my questions are...... > > 1...Has anyone from Index-L attended Thesaurus developemnt conf. in the > past? Did you get any benefit from that conf.? > > 2...what type of indexers are the *best* candidates for attending that > conf.? (Basically, I do indexes for books. I am trying to break into > periodical indexing, but so far no luck). > > 3...what type of indexers use thesaurus for indexing? Are they book indexers > or periodical or database indexers? > > 4...Is there any particular type of subject where thesaurus is developed for > creating indexes? > > Some of my questions may sound very stupid, but to be honest, my knowledge > about thesaurus is almost zero. The only thesaurus I have at home > is.....*Roget's Super Thesaurus*. > > I would appreciate a quick reply so that I can decide which workshop to > attend. Thanks in advance. > > Manjit K. Sahai > RAM Indexing Services > > _______________________________________________________________ > Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 21:17:06 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: ROBJRICH@AOL.COM Subject: Some Caveats on the "Starting Indexing Project" question Dear Susan - Well, your appeal for help has touched my heart! There seems to be an implicit innocence in that cry of despair. Why does it seem so appropriate that only last night I watched a TV special on the sinking of the Titanic? So you are trying to learn indexing by e-mail from Index-L and from the Chicago Manual of Style? God help you! I am unsure if you are asking for guidance on an individual basis, or if the plan also is to transform an entire technical writing goup into indexers. Let's try to put this in a little perspective. Keep in mind, though, that if the Truth According to Dilbert holds in this case (and it might), nothing simple and reasonable that you say will in the slightest degree deflect the course of events. 1) First, and most important, please remember that most indexing is Not That Hard!! You are not breaking new ground, nor are you alone. There is a great deal of collective experience out there. There certainly are folks who are proficient in Interleaf. It isn't necessary for you to reinvent the wheel. Remember, my questions to you are rhetorical - I don't expect you to answer them, I only hope that you will think about them.... But let's go on. 2) Regarding the "no time for classes" comment: There is an axiom in engineering that says "There never is time or money to do it right, but there always is time and money to do it over." Did you mean that your management has considered sending all your tech writers to indexing class? How many tech writers do you have? How many manuals do they generate per month/year? How large/complex are they (the manuals, not the writers)? How often are they revised? Are they individual volumes, or in sets or runs? This is not irrelevant. Sending tech writers to formal indexing classes is a charming thought. I have an image of them sitting, like surly children in an Ancient Sumerian History class on a glorious Spring day, wriggling in their chairs and scuffing their shoes, burning with the longing to Be Out Of Here! To suffer through a mandatory indexing course and Then to be laid off? Cruel world!! Is there no justice? Susan, sending all your tech writers to indexing classes in order to index a dozen or so substantive manuals per year is like buying a bakery because you want to make a ham sandwich. What complexity/volume are you talking about? 3) Landscape or portrait format is irrelevant in your case. It might make a slight difference to a freelancer bidding on a per-page basis, but that doesn't apply to in-house indexing. I haven't a clue about using Interleaf (Ahhhh......) But the medium isn't the problem right now; organization and indexing are the problems. 4) The question of whether writers or indexers do a better job of indexing will fuel heated and mindless discussions for years to come. It has a long history. The question is basically meaningless, and therefore provides a rich and fertile ground for intense academic argument. The answer is: Some Do and Some Don't. 5) In your case, the issue you raise has little to do with the intrinsic ability of writers to index. It almost certainly is (or at least should be) a management/cost question, and should pivot on how resources are to be allocated. It seems evident that [a narrow vision of] cost will be the controlling factor here. Your management must decide how to allocate resources for indexing these manuals. That is a definable task. Regardless of whether the author, an in-house indexer, or a freelancer does this work, it remains a discrete, billable task. However it sounds as though the indexes are being treated as no-cost, or low-cost, add-ons to the larger project of writing the manuals. It is almost irresistible for managers to try to "slide in" a bit more work on an existing project budget. "After all", they reason, "Indexing isn't so damned hard, and the author already knows the text. We already have the file in Interleaf. So we can get it done really cheaply (i.e., for free) if the author spends an hour or so of her spare time writing the index and bills her time to the product account. Hire a special Indexer with all that cost and overhead? No way!" But you see, Susan, nothing gets done for free. Sometimes it seems that way because small costs are buried in larger contexts. But that is like saying that cookie crumbs, being small, really have no calories. Depends on where management wants to place their priorities, and what they think they can squeeze by with (i.e., how many costs they can bury) 6) Let's assume that your hypothetical writer also can generate a good index. While doing the index, the writer can't research or write the next manual, or revise an old one. If the cost/urgency equation suggests that the manuals are critical because product is ready to go out the door and they don't have final manuals to pack in the cartons, then it is counteproductive (read: stupid) to waste the writer's time fussing with the index. But if you have writers sitting around with nothing to do, then letting them index keeps them off the street (literally). 7) If your management expects every writer to index his/her own stuff at no billable cost, then you are dead-certain to have problems. Some writers will index quite well, others will hate it. But while they are indexing they won't be writing. Index quality will be uneven, and maintaining quality control on your indexes will be an unending struggle. >From an efficiency point of view, it seems much better to have one or more dedicated, competent indexers turning out uniformly good indexes, than to have a gaggle of assorted writers go through individual learning curves and all come out at different levels of quality. Now, what I am saying does depend to some degree on how many tech writers we are talking about, and how heavy their workloads are. But if your management is serious about developing an in-house indexing capability for more than, say, a half-dozen writers, a dedicated professional in-house indexer always (repeat: ALWAYS) will work more efficiently, and produce a cleaner, better, more consistent, uniform product that will a random group of tech writers. Therefore the dedicated indexer usually is more cost-effective. And that "half-dozen writers" is an estimate, not a precise number. But if management doesn't care if the indexes are good, bad, or downright awful, then it really doesn't matter, does it? Susan, it is unlikely that indexing your tech manuals requires advanced degrees in electrical engineering, computer architecture, and information theory. The problem almost certainly is not technical. More likely it is a mixture of management commitment and cost. 8) Remember, someone must determine what administrative structure will be responsible for indexing. And how all this indexing will be tracked and budgeted. And how this workload will be fitted into existing schedules. And who (if anybody) will review the indexes for quality. You must have a clear idea of what is needed, how long a typical index will take to write and edit (i.e., how much it will cost), how many indexes per month or year will be needed, and what guidelines or house standards will be developed to instruct and comfort either in-house indexer(s) or do-it-yourself tech writers, and who will develop these guidelines!. All this doesn't have to be complicated; you are not building the Great Wall of China. But these questions DO have to be answered. Lacking that, your management can't make any realistic estimate of what it will take to "get the job done" (as the military says), and indexing the manuals always will be crisis after crisis, an endless fire drill. 9) If you are only speaking of, say, a dozen-or-so indexes per year, and if there only are one or two busy writers, it might be much more cost-effective, and certainly would be administratively much simpler, just to engage hired-gun freelancers. At least you don't have to pay freelancers any Bennies (benefits). Sometimes turnkey projects can be easier to deal with.... and can get you started as you begin to gain experience. Note: I said "turnkey, not "turkey"! 10) Memorizing the Chicago Manual of Style as a basis for starting to index your product technical manuals is like memorizing all the American Airlines/United Airlines route maps before taking a commuter plane from Boston to New York! And Chicago isn't tuned that well to the special needs of technical manual indexing. 11) Susan, the questions that you posted to Index-L suggest, strongly, that you are asking about a management/organizational problem, not a simple indexing problem. Possibly you shouldn't be the one asking those questions at all. Bell & Howell isn't exactly a Mom & Pop operation. Instead of (in addition to) trying to elicit fundamental indexing guidance from Index-L, I would suggest that you find an experienced freelance technical indexer, ideally one who also is proficient in Interleaf, and hire him/her to visit with you on a consulting basis, review your manuals, assess the workload, meet with your staff and your management (might charge extra for the management meeting!), and then write a summary report outlining a reasonable, structured, plan. Perhaps that same person would index one or two sample manuals to give you a realistic idea of one good approach to index content, organization and structure (I emphasize ONE good approach - of many possible approaches) Ah, well. These are only some thoughts that occurred to me after reading your posting. I spent many years as a department manager, and old scars occasionally twinge.... Must be the humidity! Best wishes! Bob Richardson ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 21:59:53 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Janet Russell Subject: Re: Periodical indexing > About using article titles as a heading or subheading: I wouldn't. Most > titles are completely forgettable and > some don't even hint at what the subject is. They also tend to be lengthy. > I think people mostly try to access information by subject or by author. However, one frequent use of periodical indexes is to identify articles which are then requested by interlibrary loan. The more information a requesting library can provide, the more likely it is to receive the material. Providing the title of the article as a subheading helps the ILL assistant verify that the article he or she is photocopying is the one desired. For the same reason, providing the entire page range, rather than just the initial page, is preferable. I would also disagree that article titles in journals which are likely to be indexed are usually meaningless. "The Internet and Reference Services" "Reference Service for Maps" are informative. Even "Negative Closure" becomes helpful when the subtitle is added ("Strategies and Counter-Strategies in the Reference Transaction") Very rarely, I will need to supplement the title with explanatory words in brackets. Janet Russell ========================================================================= Date: Tue, 4 May 1999 22:15:59 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Debra Lindblom Subject: Re: contacting publishers In a message dated 5/4/99 4:16:48 PM EST, scoates@SLIP.NET writes: << You need to contact the production editor. Call up the publisher and ask for the name of the production editor who is in charge of hiring indexers. That will the person you need to address. >> I've been calling quite a few publishers recently and am often given the managing editor as the person to send my resume to. Anyone else have this experience? Many times it is the production editor, but not always. Debbie ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 05:06:18 PDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Yves_Fran=E7ois_Jeaurond?= Subject: Re: contacting publishers In-Reply-To: <199905042100.RAA28510@mag1.magmacom.com> D. Borasky: Hi. Marketing? You < grin> 'absolutely must' consult Harvey Mackay's "Dig Your Well Before You're Thirsty" (Doubleday, 1997). It's about networking. It will get you started. His book about marketing "Swim with the Sharks without Being Eaten Alive" is also recommended. As for contracts, make sure there is a "The client agrees to pay the indexer x amount by y date for k amount of work." clause. Good luck. Yves jingting@magma.ca ---------- > > Hello, > I'm new to indexing and have a question about contacting publishers. = I've > seen > a > few posts to the list about mailing your marketing materials to publis= hers - > do > you address it to a specific position title (i.e. "Dear Editor")? I = imagine > this > would help get your materials to the right person, but who would that > typically > be? Is this "cold mailing" really the best way to break into the field= ? > Thanks! > D. Borasky ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:39:16 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "M. Jessie Barczak" Subject: Re: Modifying existing existing index At 04:57 PM 5/4/99 -0400, you wrote: I am very surprised they have not engaged an embedded indexing program to handle this. I think I saw a posting from someone on this list who, indeed, uses embedded indexing for looseleaf materials. MJB >I really think that this is a case where the cheapest, best option would be >to reindex from scratch. If you have the current index in a numeric view >and all of the current pages it would be POSSIBLE to update these indexes, >but frankly, the time you would spend figuring out whether the existing >index entries are good, bad or renumbered could better be spent just >reindexing the whole thing. > >No, it won't be cheap, but you could negotiate with them the depth of >indexing that they want and adjust your price accordingly. > >Good luck! > >-- Sharon W. >Sharon.Wright@Lexis-Nexis.com > >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Marite Tweeddale [SMTP:marite@PARADISE.NET.NZ] >> Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 1999 4:19 PM >> To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L >> Subject: Modifying existing existing index >> >> Dear Group >> >> I have recently been approached by 3 legal anccounting publishers who want >> their voluminous looseleaf services reindexed. >> >> In all cases these services have not had the index updated for between 18 >> months and 3 years. >> >> These looseleafs are between three and five volumes in size and average >> around 6-7,000 pages. >> >> If I can get the filing sheets I can go through from the first update to >> the >> last and insert the new terms into the existing index. >> >> My problems are as follows: >> >> 1. With looseleafs, sometimes big chunks are thrown out & replaced with >> nothing. The terms within these pages need to be removed from the index >> to >> maintian its integrity. Noone, knows now what was on these pages. >> >> 2. How will I charge for this work? Anyway I look at it it will cost so >> much that the publisher will balk. Looked at logically, though when >> divided >> by 3 years the cost is not that astronomical. >> >> 3. How long would people estimate such large jobs should take. In each >> case the publisher has wanted this done in 3-4 weeks. I think this is >> impossible. >> >> What does the group think about and taking on and negotiating projects >> such >> as these? >> >> Is there a simple way around this that I haven't thought of. In each >> instance I have said I'd take the project on but because my quotes have >> been >> so high I have heard nothing so far. >> >> All suggestions would be very welcome. >> >> Thanks in advance >> >> Marite >> >> >> >> >> >> Marite Tweeddale >> Precis, Information & Knowledge Management Services >> 136 Onslow Road, Wellington 4, New Zealand >> Tel. 00 64 4 479 6798 >> email: marite@paradise.net.nz > > ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:39:20 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sandi Schroeder Subject: Hotel Reservations If you have not previously contacted me about problems with the hotel reservation system, I would like to hear from you. If you are staying elsewhere because you were told the room block at the Crowne Plaza was gone. If you have rooms priced higher than the $99 block rate. Give me your confirmation number here. Sandi ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:28:58 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Linda and John Stevens Subject: mailbox question This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------A349C44E943BD5D9593EA97D Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I do not know what to expect. Thanks in advance, Linda --------------A349C44E943BD5D9593EA97D Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Linda and John Stevens Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: Linda and John Stevens n: Stevens;Linda and John email;internet: ljstevens@efortress.com x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: TRUE version: 2.1 end: vcard --------------A349C44E943BD5D9593EA97D-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:33:05 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: DStaub11@AOL.COM Subject: Fwd: error in someone's email address? --part1_2be58d51.2461beb1_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I just got this. I'm sending it to Charlotte and the list. Does someone's email address have a typo in it? Do Mi --part1_2be58d51.2461beb1_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from rly-zb04.mx.aol.com (rly-zb04.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.4]) by air-zb02.mail.aol.com (v59.4) with SMTP; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:56:22 -0400 Received: from mailgw02.execpc.com (mailgw02.execpc.com [169.207.3.78]) by rly-zb04.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id KAA22415 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 10:56:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: from Teiana.myoffice.com (as3-35.isdn.mke.execpc.com [169.207.71.163]) by mailgw02.execpc.com (8.9.1) id JAA24957 for ; Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:56:20 -0500 Date: Thu, 29 Apr 1999 09:56:20 -0500 Message-Id: <199904291456.JAA24957@mailgw02.execpc.com> X-Sender: zeppospr@mail.execpc.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: DStaub11@AOL.COM From: "Zeppos & Associates, Incorporated" Subject: Binghamton Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We have been receiving e-mails from a list serve called bingvmb.cc.binghamton.edu addressed to abaker@zeppos.com. I saw your e-mail address and thought maybe you can assist us. We cannot figure out how to remove this person from the list. Please advise. --part1_2be58d51.2461beb1_boundary-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 08:57:14 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sonsie Conroy Subject: Re: mailbox question At 11:28 AM 5/5/1999 -0400, Linda and John Stevens wrote: >Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to >register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials >sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large >enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I >do not know what to expect. Most of my proofs are either 8.5 x 11 or 11 x 17...both sizes too large for the standard P.O. box. If you have a Mailboxes Etc. or similar operation nearby, I would suggest using them for your mail and renting their smallest box. They will put a notice in your box when oversized packages arrive, and you can pick them up at the desk. The reason I recommend someone other than the Post Office is that the private outfits generally have longer hours, are open weekends, and are happy to check your box if you call in by phone and ask--which saves you a trip. They will also accept shipments from UPS and FedEx for you, another boon if you can't arrange for safe home delivery when you're not there. Sonsie sconroy@slonet.org ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:30:19 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Mary Mortensen Subject: Re: mailbox question > Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to > register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials > sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large > enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I > do not know what to expect. Linda, If you are thinking about packages of page proofs, those are usually sent (in my experience anyway) by an express delivery service (FedEx, UPS, Airborne) as time is usually an issue. Those services cannot deliver to post office boxes. If you would rather not have them deliver to your home, I think your best alternative is a company like Mailboxes Etc. where you can rent a box. They accept packages for clients all the time. I assume you're in the U.S.; I don't know how it works in Canada or other countries. HTH, Mary -- * Mary Mortensen * marymort@aol.com * Lawrence, Kansas, USA ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 09:35:26 +0000 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sylvia Coates Subject: Re: mailbox question Dear Linda, If you get a P.O. Box it will have to be one of those which has a street address and not just a P.O. number. Most of my clients use Federal Express (though some also use other carriers) which will not deliver to a P.O. Box address. And, yes, most (but not all) of my packages are too large to fit into a home mailbox. I have a permanent sign off with Fed Ex which makes it unnecessary for me to be home in order to sign for the package. They, and everyone else, leave it at the front door. We remodeled the front of our house, including the front entry way, about six years ago. I asked for a front porch with an extended roof in order to protect incoming packages from the elements (i.e. rain). It works out great for me! Best, Sylvia Coates Linda and John Stevens wrote: > This is a multi-part message in MIME format. > --------------A349C44E943BD5D9593EA97D > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to > register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials > sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large > enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I > do not know what to expect. > > Thanks in advance, > Linda > > --------------A349C44E943BD5D9593EA97D > Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" > Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Content-Description: Card for Linda and John Stevens > Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" > > begin: vcard > fn: Linda and John Stevens > n: Stevens;Linda and John > email;internet: ljstevens@efortress.com > x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 > x-mozilla-html: TRUE > version: 2.1 > end: vcard > > --------------A349C44E943BD5D9593EA97D-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:18:28 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Iris B. Ailin-Pyzik" Subject: Re: mailbox question I rented my PO box some time ago, for a different business venture, and it may indeed be too small, but... Some of the newer post offices (not mine) have oversized boxes for packages, and they put the key to the appropriate box in your small box, so you can get it at any time, and you just leave the key in the big box after you've retrieved your stuff - so ask. We have none of the Mailboxes Etc. operations conveniently near where I live, and UPS and FedEx can leave things at my door, so I'm not worried about that. Note that FedEx almost always wants a signature, unless the sender marks it as not required. YOU HAVE TO TELL THEM TO DO THIS. If the depot for these outfits is near you, it is easy to pick up the item if necessary. UPS has one near me, but FedEx does not. FedEx will let you sign a form to leave any item without a signature, but I'm leery of doing that as a blanket order. If you are expecting an item that you know needs a signature, and you want them to leave it, you can leave a note at the door authorizing them to leave a package from XYZ (include the tracking # if you happen to have it), and sign the note. Iris Sonsie Conroy wrote: > > At 11:28 AM 5/5/1999 -0400, Linda and John Stevens wrote: > > >Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to > >register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials > >sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large > >enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I > >do not know what to expect. > > Most of my proofs are either 8.5 x 11 or 11 x 17...both sizes too large for > the standard P.O. box. If you have a Mailboxes Etc. or similar operation > nearby, I would suggest using them for your mail and renting their smallest > box. They will put a notice in your box when oversized packages arrive, and > you can pick them up at the desk. > > The reason I recommend someone other than the Post Office is that the > private outfits generally have longer hours, are open weekends, and are > happy to check your box if you call in by phone and ask--which saves you a > trip. They will also accept shipments from UPS and FedEx for you, another > boon if you can't arrange for safe home delivery when you're not there. > > Sonsie > sconroy@slonet.org ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:55:19 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Joanne Clendenen Subject: ASI Vice President position Hello to all. Hate to do this, but.... Having been informed that I have won the recent election for ASI Vice President/President Elect, I will regretfully have to resign the position now. I was originally eagerly looking forward to the opportunity to work so closely with an organization that I truly admire. Without ASI, I might never have made the contacts necessary to get my indexing career started, nor would I have had the deep satisfaction of giving back to that organization through chapter work and professional development workshops. It's a very fine thing, indeed, to pass the benefits I have received on to others. Unfortunately, my personal life has taken quite a difficult turn in the past two months. I knew that I could not do any justice to this position, and I would be doing a grave disservice to ASI, if I tried to carry out the duties of this office under my current personal circumstances. My decision has absolutely nothing to do with any difficulties that the ASI board has had in the past. My reasons for resigning are clearly and most definitely personal in nature. I most humbly apologize for any inconvenience caused by my need to resig n. I have every confidence that a new election will produce a fine VP for ASI. Once my situation settles down, I will actively seek committee work at the national level, as well as continuing my work in my chapter. And I'm certain that at some point in the future, I will be able to serve on the ASI board. I look forward to that opportunity. Joanne Clendenen AfterWords Indexing Services Joanne E. Clendenen email: jbclend@bigfoot.com 281-469-4461 http://www.flash.net/~jbclend ---------------- "A good book is the precious lifeblood of a master spirit, embalmed and treasured up on purpose to a life beyond life." John Milton ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:08:20 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Craig Brown Subject: Re: mailbox question On 5/5/1999 10:28 AM Linda and John Stevens wrote (in part): >Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to >register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials >sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large >enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I >do not know what to expect. Another wrinkle is that some of the companies like Mailboxes Etc will not allow you to use the term "P.O. box," "box," or even "drawer." You have to use a term like "room." Craig Brown ===================================================== The Last Word lastword@i1.net Indexing http://www.i1.net/~lastword (314)352-9094 fax: (314)481-9254 ===================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 13:18:20 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "John R. Sullivan" Subject: Re: mailbox question Did anyone else see the article in the Wall Street Journal the other day about the US Post Office's new requirement that items addressed to locations such as Mailboxes Etc. include a PMB ("private mail box") designation? Many small business owners are up in arms about this, since one reason they use someplace like Mailboxes Etc. is to make it seem as though they have a "real" business address. John Sullivan > -----Original Message----- > From: Craig Brown [SMTP:lastword@I1.NET] > Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 1:08 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list INDEX-L > Subject: Re: mailbox question > > On 5/5/1999 10:28 AM Linda and John Stevens wrote (in part): > > >Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to > >register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials > >sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large > >enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I > >do not know what to expect. > > Another wrinkle is that some of the companies like Mailboxes Etc will not > allow you to use the term "P.O. box," "box," or even "drawer." You have > to use a term like "room." > > Craig Brown > > ===================================================== > The Last Word lastword@i1.net > Indexing http://www.i1.net/~lastword > (314)352-9094 fax: (314)481-9254 > ===================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 11:29:52 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Robin Hilp Subject: Re: QUERY: company beginnning indexing program If you haven't time to take classes, please make some indexing textbooks available for your indexing writers to read on their own time. The ASI website has a good recommended booklist. I'm in the "don't do your own index" camp, for exactly the reasons Jan already mentioned. My suggestion would be to have your writers index for each other, ideally on manuals with dissimilar content. === RolyBear ICQ 1863181 (Robin Hilp) _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 12:20:02 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Jeri Lee Subject: Re: mailbox question In-Reply-To: <199905051710.KAA22843@mx1.eskimo.com> --=====================_25920377==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have used a mainbox service in the past and wrote my return address as 1122 X Street, Ste. 104 (box number). Makes it sound like a business address for without the business rent! Jeri Lee At 12:08 PM 5/5/1999 -0500, you wrote: >On 5/5/1999 10:28 AM Linda and John Stevens wrote (in part): > >>Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question. I plan to >>register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials >>sent from publishers. Is the standard size of a home mailbox large >>enough or do I need a super-size? A mundane issue to be sure, but I >>do not know what to expect. > >Another wrinkle is that some of the companies like Mailboxes Etc will not >allow you to use the term "P.O. box," "box," or even "drawer." You have >to use a term like "room." > >Craig Brown > >===================================================== > The Last Word lastword@i1.net > Indexing http://www.i1.net/~lastword > (314)352-9094 fax: (314)481-9254 >===================================================== > --=====================_25920377==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" I have used a mainbox service in the past and wrote my return address as 1122 X Street, Ste. 104 (box number).
Makes it sound like a business address for without the business rent!

Jeri Lee  

At 12:08 PM 5/5/1999 -0500, you wrote:
>On 5/5/1999 10:28 AM Linda and John Stevens wrote (in part):
>
>>Hi all - I am a beginning indexer with a rather odd question.  I plan to
>>register for a P.O. box and am wondering about the size of materials
>>sent from publishers.  Is the standard size of a home mailbox large
>>enough or do I need a super-size?   A mundane issue  to be sure, but I
>>do not know what to expect.
>
>Another wrinkle is that some of the companies like Mailboxes Etc will not
>allow you to use the term "P.O. box," "box," or even "drawer."  You have
>to use a term like "room."
>
>Craig Brown
>
>=====================================================
>  The Last Word        lastword@i1.net
>    Indexing           http://www.i1.net/~lastword
>  (314)352-9094        fax: (314)481-9254
>=====================================================
>
--=====================_25920377==_.ALT-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 20:25:54 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Ann Daley Subject: Fwd: instruction writers needed --part1_9ce68db9.24623b92_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Please respond to the contact below, not to the LIST. Thanks In a message dated 5/5/99 5:12:10 PM Eastern Daylight Time, azaria@texterity.com writes: Looking for people to write instructions for offshore data entry. These instructions need to be highly detailed and in simple, easy to understand English. You need to be analytical and detail oriented. This project is under tight time deadlines and you need to work quickly and effectively. programming courses/exposure is desirable but not required. Positions are available immediately and run through the summer. For more information, please contact: Adrienne Azaria Texterity Inc. 233 Needham St. Newton, MA 02464 617-527-3230 617-527-1929 FAX azaria@texterity.com --part1_9ce68db9.24623b92_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-Path: Received: from rly-zb01.mx.aol.com (rly-zb01.mail.aol.com [172.31.41.1]) by air-zb02.mail.aol.com (v59.4) with SMTP; Wed, 05 May 1999 17:12:10 -0400 Received: from sparki.texterity.com (sparki.texterity.com [192.233.55.12]) by rly-zb01.mx.aol.com (8.8.8/8.8.5/AOL-4.0.0) with ESMTP id RAA08956 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:12:09 -0400 (EDT) Received: from whiskers.texterity.com (whiskers [192.233.55.39]) by sparki.texterity.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA02377 for ; Wed, 5 May 1999 17:12:08 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19990505171654.007c0c40@texterity.com> X-Sender: azaria@texterity.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 05 May 1999 17:16:54 -0400 To: adaley3521@aol.com From: Adrienne Azaria Subject: instruction writer needed Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Looking for people to write instructions for offshore data entry. These instructions need to be highly detailed and in simple, easy to understand English. You need to be analytical and detail oriented. This project is under tight time deadlines and you need to work quickly and effectively. programming courses/exposure is desirable but not required. Positions are available immediately and run through the summer. For more information, please contact: Adrienne Azaria Texterity Inc. 233 Needham St. Newton, MA 02464 617-527-3230 617-527-1929 FAX azaria@texterity.com --part1_9ce68db9.24623b92_boundary-- ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 22:09:25 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Joanne Clendenen Subject: Read: Subject area Inquiry eJ8+IhkDAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAIAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5SZWFkIFJlY2VpcHQAAwsBDYAEAAIAAAACAAIAAQqAAQAhAAAARkMzMUU4RjNB NUZERDIxMTk4RTgwMDYwMDg5RDIxMTIAGgcBA5AGAKAEAAAiAAAACwAjAAAAAAADACYAAAAAAAsA KQAAAAAAAgExAAEAAAAWAQAAUENERkVCMDkAAQACAHAAAAAAAAAAOKG7EAXlEBqhuwgAKypWwgAA RU1TTURCLkRMTAAAAAAAAAAAG1X6IKpmEc2byACqAC/EWgwAAABPU0NBUgAvbz1BT0QgTmV0d29y ay9vdT1NU0ovY249UmVjaXBpZW50cy9jbj1NYXJqIE0ALgAAAAAAAACelczfjuDREZinAGAInSES AQC/MFAxib/REZh8AGAInSESAAAAARLaAAAAAAAALgAAAAAAAACelczfjuDREZinAGAInSESAQC/ MFAxib/REZh8AGAInSESAAAAARLbAAAQAAAA/DHo86X90hGY6ABgCJ0hEhUAAABTdWJqZWN0IGFy ZWEgSW5xdWlyeQAAAEAAMgCA/XjGbZe+AQMANgAAAAAAAgFDAAEAAABBAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZ nW4A3QEPVAIAAAEATWFyaiBNaXRjaGVsbABTTVRQAG1taXRjaGVsbEBNU0pDT1JQLkNPTQAAAAAe AEQAAQAAAA4AAABNYXJqIE1pdGNoZWxsAAAAHgBJAAEAAAAVAAAAU3ViamVjdCBhcmVhIElucXVp cnkAAAAAAgFMAAEAAABaAAAAAAAAAIErH6S+oxAZnW4A3QEPVAIAAAEASW5kZXhlcidzIERpc2N1 c3Npb24gR3JvdXAAU01UUABJTkRFWC1MQGJpbmd2bWIuY2MuYmluZ2hhbXRvbi5lZHUAAAAeAE0A AQAAABsAAABJbmRleGVyJ3MgRGlzY3Vzc2lvbiBHcm91cAAAQABOAED/jk/Mkb4BQABVAAAX3w3N kb4BHgBwAAEAAAAVAAAAU3ViamVjdCBhcmVhIElucXVpcnkAAAAAAgFxAAEAAAAbAAAAAb6Ry5ot p28Btf1wEdKKsAAQSyL9iQFoixK2AB4AcgABAAAAAQAAAAAAAAAeAHMAAQAAAAEAAAAAAAAAHgB0 AAEAAAAkAAAATXVsdGlwbGUgcmVjaXBpZW50cyBvZiBsaXN0IElOREVYLUwACwAIDAAAAAACAR0M AQAAABcAAABTTVRQOkpCQ0xFTkRARkxBU0guTkVUAAALAAEOAQAAAAsAHw4BAAAAHgABEAEAAAAV AAAATWVzc2FnZSB3YXMgcmVhZCBvbjoAAAAAAwAGEAAAAAADAAcQAAAAAB4ACBABAAAABgAAAORF DgEEAAAAAwAQEJT70gIDABEQ5AQAAAIB+A8BAAAAEAAAAKvrxR04AtIRjbRERVNUAAACAfoPAQAA ABAAAACr68UdOALSEY20REVTVAAAAgH7DwEAAABQAAAAAAAAADihuxAF5RAaobsIACsqVsIAAFBT VFBSWC5ETEwAAAAAAAAAAE5JVEH5v7gBAKoAN9luAAAAQzpcV0lORE9XU1xvdXRsb29rLnBzdAAD AP4PBQAAAAMADTT9NwAAAgF/AAEAAAAxAAAAMDAwMDAwMDBBQkVCQzUxRDM4MDJEMjExOERCNDQ0 NDU1MzU0MDAwMDI0QTIyNzAwAAAAACoQ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 12:10:36 +0100 Reply-To: jsampson@indexes.u-net.com Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "J.R. Sampson" Subject: Re: Read: Subject area Inquiry In-Reply-To: I have received another coded message under this title, this time apparently from Joanne Clenenden. Regards _John Sampson_ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 04:52:15 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Philip Montgomery Subject: Re: Virus Alert [a real one] Depends upon the virus. Some are designed only to trigger on a specific date and/or time. Others, will trigger on or after the appointed date and time. Also, depending on the age of your pc's internal clock/calendar, you could have a virus and it won't trigger at all. Regular virus scanning and following safe hex practices is the best route to follow. Most commercial virus software can be configured to scan when you start your system. Most will scan any floppy disk(s) you try to use and prevent access if any is infected. Phil Montgomery -- the voice of an unkind experience. --- Pam Rider wrote: > Can a person reset their computer calendar (date) > mechanism and avoid the > virus? > Pam Rider > Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth > prider@electriciti.com > prider@tsktsk.com > _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Wed, 5 May 1999 14:46:17 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Rachel Rice Subject: job op that I posted about In-Reply-To: <92590771301@voyager.together.net> Hi all, I heard from Judy Ashkenaz whom I posted about yesterday as needing copyeditors and proofreaders. She was a bit overwhelmed by the response and asked me to pass along that she does NOT want any follow up phone calls, and does NOT want any attached files to emails. She says all the people who wrote to her look suitable and will go into their freelancer database, and she didn't reject anyone's, but that you might not get a call for days or months. (My original marketing to her was done about 2 months ago.) She said phone calls and attached files will go against you, though. If anyone else is planning to contact her, she says just to put a good summary of your abilities and experience into a regular email message and to make sure to put how to reach you other than by email, and that will suit her well. She said she was really pleased with the response, it's just that she doesn't have time for phone calls, and a lot of your attachments weren't readable. So anyway, there it is. Good luck, Rae Rachel Rice Directions Unlimited Desktop Services Indexing, editing, proofreading http://homepages.together.net/~racric racric ICQ 31476947 ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:59:56 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Richard Munro Subject: ASCII Format I have been asked to provide an index in ASCII format. Surely RTF will suffice? Anyone got any advice? Richard Munro RM Editorial Services Crossfield Church Road Beyton Bury St Edmunds Suffolk IP30 9AL England Tel/fax: +44-1359-271023 ========================================================================= Date: Mon, 10 May 1999 09:07:26 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Julie Sherman Grayson Subject: Re: ASCII Format If you're sending via e-mail or on disk - just send two copies of the file in two different formats and let them choose. Julie Grayson juliesg@ix.netcom.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:07:50 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sharon Hughes Subject: Re: ASCII Format In a message dated 99-05-06 09:02:16 EDT, you write: << I have been asked to provide an index in ASCII format. >> ASCII is different from RTF. There are no codes other than the end of lines. You will need to insert codes for special characters. You can ask the publisher if another format will work. Maybe they are taking instructions from the typesetters. You can always ask to speak with them about format. Sharon ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 06:09:17 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Philip Montgomery Subject: Re: Microsoft Access for indexing It should be possible to modify your Access tables to accommodate whatever you need. From what you say that may be a little beyond. . . Access is a relational database. While you can, and generally do, designate specific fields as keys, it is possible to set up a table that is only keys to other tables. Each of the related tables must have a common key field. If you haven't encountered it yet -- database key fields (indexes) must be unique and unambiguous. If not you will miss records and get erroneous results. Good luck. --- Judith Metcalf wrote: > I'm brand new to INDEX-L, so apologize if this > question has been discussed > before. > Have any of you had experience using Access for > periodical indexing? > I inherited an established Access periodical index > which has the maximum > sized key word field, which I've been filling with > a mix of key words and > phrases, along with some broader terms which might > incidentally serve as > subject headings, but obviously what it needs is a > real subject authority > list. Is there a way to create one with Access? If > so, which version? > I did take a one day class in Access, but the > instructor was only concerned > with the creation and manipulation of the tables. > I've also scanned some > books on Access, but had no luck. > Thanks in advance. > _________________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 09:14:42 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Craig Brown Subject: Fathers and sons I'm on the final leg of a biography index and searching for solutions to identical names of fathers and sons, specifically Oliver Wendell Holmes and Henry James, two father/son pairs. In both cases it would be inappropriate to use "Jr." or "II" because that isn't the case. I also can't use (father) or (son) because those are reserved for relatives of the biographee. I've considered using: James, Henry (philosopher) James, Henry (writer) Holmes, Oliver Wendell (writer) Holmes, Oliver Wendell (jurist) I could probably also use the dates of their lives. I will consult the author, but before I do would like to poll the list for other alternatives. tia, Craig Brown ===================================================== The Last Word lastword@i1.net Indexing http://www.i1.net/~lastword (314)352-9094 fax: (314)481-9254 ===================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 10:18:51 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: John and Kara Pekar Subject: trademark/registered mark reference Does anyone know of a reference (online or print) which lists common trademarked or registered names/words/phrases? I keep needing to check these, and it's a pain to do an individual search on each name. Thanks, Kara Pekar Wordsmith Indexing Services jkpekar@crosslink.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 10:27:09 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: John and Kara Pekar Subject: Re: Fathers and sons Craig Brown wrote: > I'm on the final leg of a biography index and searching for solutions to > identical names of fathers and sons, specifically Oliver Wendell Holmes > and Henry James, two father/son pairs. In both cases it would be > inappropriate to use "Jr." or "II" because that isn't the case. I also > can't use (father) or (son) because those are reserved for relatives of > the biographee. I've considered using: > > James, Henry (philosopher) > James, Henry (writer) > Holmes, Oliver Wendell (writer) > Holmes, Oliver Wendell (jurist) > > I could probably also use the dates of their lives. I would use the dates, as without familiarity with the individuals, qualifiers such as writer/philosopher aren't much help. (And surely a philosopher did some writing? ) Just my two cents, Kara Pekar Wordsmith Indexing Services jkpekar@crosslink.net ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 08:03:14 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Pam Rider Subject: Re: Fathers and sons In-Reply-To: <199905061440.HAA05002@decibel.electriciti.com> At 10:27 AM 5/6/99 -0400, Craig asked about: >Craig Brown wrote: > James, Henry (philosopher) > James, Henry (writer) > Holmes, Oliver Wendell (writer) > Holmes, Oliver Wendell (jurist) > I would prefer label and dates Holmes, Oliver Wendell (writer, 1809-1894) Holmes, Oliver Wendell (jurist, 1841-1935) James, Henry (American philosopher, writer, 1811-1882) James, Henry (American novelist, 1843-1916) There is a British Henry James. Pam Rider Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth prider@electriciti.com prider@tsktsk.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 11:02:07 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group Comments: W: MESSAGE-ID field duplicated. Last occurrence was retained. From: Karen Lane Subject: Re: trademark/registered mark reference Kara wrote -- >Does anyone know of a reference (online or print) which lists common >trademarked or registered names/words/phrases? I keep needing to check >these, and it's a pain to do an individual search on each name. You can try http://plaza.interport.net/inta/tmchklst.htm Karen Lane klane@digital.net klane@klane.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:12:09 -0000 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Christine Shuttleworth Subject: Re: Fathers and sons Pam Rider wrote: Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Linda Sutherland Subject: Re: archives; biblical texts The message <199904281230.NAA01212@irwell.zetnet.co.uk> from marvant duhon contains these words: > The most commonly used Protestant version of the Bible is > generally called the King James version, after the English monarch at the > time the project was completed. English ? !!! On the day Scotland elects its first Parliament in nearly 300 years, I cannot let this pass !! :-) He was Scottish by birth, and ruled Scotland first before adding England to his string. The message <199904282245.XAA13390@irwell.zetnet.co.uk> from Toni Williams TPG/SG contains these words: > Kings James IV & I of Scotland and England Only one King - James Sixth of Scotland and First of England was one and the same person. -- Linda Sutherland linda.sutherland@zetnet.co.uk ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 10:56:32 -0700 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Pam Rider Subject: Re: Fathers and sons In-Reply-To: <199905061630.JAA08021@newton.electriciti.com> yup. At 04:12 PM 5/6/99 -0000, you wrote: >Pam Rider wrote: > > >Just out of curiosity: the only British Henry James I can trace is Henry >James, 1st Baron of Hereford (1828-1911), a lawyer and member of Parliament, >who became attorney general in 1873. Is this the one you mean, Pam? > >Christine > >************************************************************ >Christine Shuttleworth, Indexing & Editorial Services >Flat 1, 25 St Stephen's Avenue >London W12 8JB >cshuttle@dircon.co.uk >************************************************************ > > Pam Rider Trying to walk cheerfully on the Earth prider@electriciti.com prider@tsktsk.com ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 14:44:27 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Linda and John Stevens Subject: thanks This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------E260F5125B679A36866A93A3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Thanks to all who responded to my mailbox question - I now have a better idea of what to do. Linda --------------E260F5125B679A36866A93A3 Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii; name="vcard.vcf" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Description: Card for Linda and John Stevens Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="vcard.vcf" begin: vcard fn: Linda and John Stevens n: Stevens;Linda and John email;internet: ljstevens@efortress.com x-mozilla-cpt: ;0 x-mozilla-html: TRUE version: 2.1 end: vcard --------------E260F5125B679A36866A93A3-- ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 20:20:03 +0100 Reply-To: jsampson@indexes.u-net.com Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "J.R. Sampson" Subject: Re: Fathers and sons In-Reply-To: > James, Henry (American novelist, 1843-1916) This Henry James took British citizenship in 1915. Regards _John Sampson_ ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 16:55:03 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Diane Worden Subject: Re: Fathers and sons Craig, In a message dated 99-05-06 10:16:55 EDT, you write: << use the dates of their lives >> This seems unequivocal to me. Diane in Kazoo ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:04:01 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Hannah Huse Subject: Colorado Chapter - May meeting announcement The Colorado Chapter of ASI will meet on May 22, 1999, in Boulder, Colorado at the Boulder Public Library meeting room (9th Street between Canyon and Arapahoe, west of Broadway, park on either side). There will be a business meeting, including chapter elections, from 10:00-11:00 AM. The program from 11:00 to 12:30 will have presentations from Deborah Lynes of D&D Editorial Services and Susan McRory of ABC-CLIO. Topics to be explored will include how indexers are selected, editing of the index, rate structures, problems such as space and schedule slippage, and preferred computer format and encoding. There will be a post-meeting luncheon at the nearby Orchid Pavilion Restaurant (Chinese). The speakers will be our guests and you are welcome to join. If you wish to attend the luncheon, please contact the chapter so we can make reservations (huse@aol.com or 303-442-2847). ========================================================================= Date: Thu, 6 May 1999 17:19:27 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Szews, Susan K." Subject: THANKS: company beginnning indexing program Thanks to all who gave me their opinions and advice on starting an indexing program at my company, and on using the Interleaf embedded indexing tool. I've also forwarded all pertinent information to my boss, so hopefully we will NOT be producing indexes as an after-thought to the manual! Thanks again - Susan Szews Senior Technical Writer Bell & Howell Mail Messaging and Technologies Chicago, IL ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 13:23:55 +1000 Reply-To: diagonal@hermes.net.au Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Jonathan Jermey and Glenda Browne Subject: New AusSI newsletter on Web By the time you read this the AusSI newsletter for April should be available on the Web at http://www.zeta.org.au/~aussi/anl/9904may ------------------------------ Jonathan Jermey Webmaster, Australian Society of Indexers http://www.zeta.org.au/~aussi ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 08:01:51 -0500 Reply-To: horne@fwb.gulf.net Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Bob Horne Subject: Re: trademark/registered mark reference John and Kara Pekar wrote: > > Does anyone know of a reference (online or print) which lists common > trademarked or registered names/words/phrases? I keep needing to check > these, and it's a pain to do an individual search on each name. > > Thanks, > Kara Pekar > Wordsmith Indexing Services > jkpekar@crosslink.net An old reference, possibly out of date, is the U.S. Trademark Association's Trademark Hotline, (212) 986-5880, weekdays 2:00 - 5:00 p.m. EST. Bob ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 09:53:23 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "M. Jessie Barczak" Subject: Re: trademark/registered mark reference >John and Kara Pekar wrote: >> >> Does anyone know of a reference (online or print) which lists common >> trademarked or registered names/words/phrases? I keep needing to check >> these, and it's a pain to do an individual search on each name. >> >> Thanks, >> Kara Pekar >> Wordsmith Indexing Services >> jkpekar@crosslink.net > See also: the U.S. Patent & Trademark website: http://www.uspto.gov/web/menu/tm.html The site includes a link to the Official Gazette, but that will not help you at this point. You may want to visit a law library that is also a government documents repository and check to see if they have the Official Gazette. The purpose of this publication is to publish trademark name and design applications for public inspection and possible challenges. Good luck! M. Jessie Barczak Washington, D.C. ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 10:16:56 -0400 Reply-To: "Seth A. Maislin" Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Seth A. Maislin" Organization: Focus Information Services This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_001B_01BE9872.BC9AAE20 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Trademark information is available online at http://www.plaza.interport.net/inta/tmchklst.htm . 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The websites and references you pointed me toward were very helpful. I was able to verify the trademarked status of all the terms on my list to check, and I'm sure I'll be using those sources again in the future. Kara Pekar Wordsmith Indexing Services jkpekar@crosslink.net ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 10:36:52 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Sandi Schroeder Subject: Web Indexing at the Indianapolis Conference I have been able to open Web Indexing back up at the Indianapolis Conference for a few more spots. That's the good news. The bad news is hotel space. We still have space available on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday nights at the $99 rate. It is being held through May 11. The hotel is sold out for Wednesday, June 9. The Crowne Plaza is referring people to the Holiday Inn North at 317-872-9790. This is the nearest Holiday Inn. It is possible that some transportation can be arranged if enough people are staying there. Other hotels with some space include The Residence Inn, 350 W. New York Street, 317-822-0840 at $139 Hampton Inn Downtown, 105 S. Meridian St., 317-261-1200 $109 Embassy Suites Hotel Downtown, 110 W. Washington, 317-262-8100 at $169 Radisson Hotel City Centre, 31 W. Ohio St., 317-635-2000 $139 Days Inn Downtown, 401 E. Washington St., 317-637-6464 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 12:03:27 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: "Nancy A. Guenther" Subject: Work at home & kids In-Reply-To: <199903112007.PAA28854@carriage.chesco.com> Hi, After completing my latest overnight indexing marathon & uploading the project to the publisher, I was trying to clear out odds & ends. I came across an article -- "10 Ways to have Happy Kids while you work at home" For as much as this topic cycles through our discussions, I thought others might want to read it. http://www.homeworkingmom.com/kids.htm Having freelanced since 1983 with 3 children, ages now 17, 15, and 8, I can affirm that the ideas presented can work. Nancy Guenther nanguent@chesco.com ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 12:20:04 EDT Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Peg Mauer Subject: Re: trademark/registered mark reference > Does anyone know of a reference (online or print) which lists common > trademarked or registered names/words/phrases? Try: http://plaza.interport.net/inta/tmchklst.htm#TMC The site describes it as: This Trademark Checklist has been compiled by the International Trademark Association (INTA) to assist authors, writers, journalists/editors, proofreaders and fact checkers with proper trademark usage. It includes listings for nearly 4,000 trademarks and service marks with their generic terms and indicates capitalization and punctuation... And they have a phone number for more information. Peg Mauer phone: (518) 359-8616 Indexing, Technical Writing fax: (518) 359-8235 http://www.asindexing.org <-- What's Indexing? http://www.stc.org/pics/indexing/ <-- Manager of STC Indexing SIG http://members.aol.com/Pmauer <-- See my award-winning web site! ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 10:02:08 -0700 Reply-To: ljm2001@mindspring.com Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: LJM Subject: Trademark info Here's a more recent url for the INTA: http://www.inta.org/fr-abwttm.htm ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 17:21:15 -0500 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Craig Brown Subject: Re: Fathers and sons Thanks to all who responded to my query. The author also likes using life dates to distinguish among fathers and sons with the same name. Thanks! Craig Brown ===================================================== The Last Word lastword@i1.net Indexing http://www.i1.net/~lastword (314)352-9094 fax: (314)481-9254 ===================================================== ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:34:10 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Lori Lathrop Subject: Special Election The recent ballot for ASI's 1999-2000 Officers and Directors had two excellent candidates for the position of Vice President/President-Elect: = Joanne Clendenen and Dick Evans. It was a very close race, with just 38 votes separating them. Joanne was elected, and she is willing to serve temporarily; however, she is unable to serve a complete term. = Consequently, we will be mailing a Special Ballot to all ASI members for the position of Vice President-President-Elect. Dick Evans will be a candidate on the Special Ballot; at this point, I do not know for sure whether or not there will be another candidate. The position of Vice President/President-Elect is very important because whoever is in that office is responsible for planning ASIs next annual conference. The ASI Annual Conference is the biggest event of our year, and preparations for it require an incredible amount of time and effort. = Preliminary planning and publicity for ASI's 2000 annual conference canno= t afford to wait until we have a new Vice President; consequently, I have volunteered to initiate the conference planning activities for ASI's 2000= Annual Conference, and Dick Evans has volunteered to help me. Regardless= of who is elected to the office of Vice President/President-Elect, we wil= l both continue to serve on the conference planning committee. Lori Lathrop ASI President, 1998-1999 ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 18:35:45 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Lori Lathrop Subject: Call for Proposals FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE CONTACT: Lori Lathrop (LoriLathrop@compuserve.com) / Phone: 704-531-0021= or Dick Evans (Infodex@mindspring.com) / Phone: 919-781-4302 CALL FOR PROPOSALS American Society of Indexers 32nd Annual Conference UP, UP AND AWAY! Sheraton Old Town May 10-13, 2000 Albuquerque, NM ASI is accepting proposals for general session presentations, workshops, and roundtable discussions at its 32nd = Annual Conference, which is scheduled for May 10-13, at the Sheraton Old Town in Albuquerque, New Mexico. The theme of the ASI 2000 Annual Conference is UP, UP AND AWAY! Your proposal may be on any of the following topics: Advanced Indexing Techniques Basic Indexing Skills Bibliographic Citations Branching Out and Building Your Portfolio Client/Indexer Relationships Editing Indexes Embedded Indexing Techniques Index Usability Studies Indexing Electronic Documents Indexing Historical Texts Indexing Periodicals Indexing Scholarly Texts Indexing Scientific and Medical Texts Indexing Technical Documentation Indexing Web Documents Legal Indexing Managing Large Indexing Projects Marketing Skills Negotiating with Clients Putting Your Best Foot Forward with Publishers Resources for Professional Indexers Teaching Indexing Tools of the Trade Trends in Technology SUBMISSION DEADLINE: October 15, 1999 Your proposal should contain the following information: 1. Your name, address, phone/fax numbers, and e-mail address 2. A brief bio (less than 150 words) that describes your qualifications a= nd experience 3. Title of your proposed presentation 4. Format: (select one of the following: General Session Presentation or= Panel Discussion (30-40 minutes), Workshop (one-half day or full-day), or Roundtable Discussion (1.5 hours) 5. A/V equipment requirements 6. A one-page abstract describing your presentation, panel discussion, workshop, or group activities (if any). Presentations and panel discussions should be 20-45 minutes and should allow 10-15 minutes for questions from the audience. Workshop length may be either one-half day or full-day. = Roundtable hosts should have sufficient material to promote discussion for approximately 1.5 hours. Happy indexing! .... Lori Lathrop ========================================================================= Date: Fri, 7 May 1999 19:24:26 -0400 Reply-To: Indexer's Discussion Group Sender: Indexer's Discussion Group From: Deborah Patton Subject: job announcement As Washington, DC Chapter Chair of ASI, I'm posting this job announcement. Please reply directly to AOL since I have no connection to them. Good luck! Deborah Patton -------------------- "Senior Editor" Posting Number: PH326WP Department Name: Web Products Status: Full Time Location: Dulles, VA Major duties and responsibilities: America Online, Inc. seeks individuals to review, evaluate, select, and manage content for one of the fastest growing web directories. In addition, these individuals will be responsible for managing and updating a hierarchical Internet classification system. America Online, Inc.'s fast-paced environment requires that all candidates possess the enthusiasm and flexibility to work in a highly dynamic situation. Internet skills a must. Ideal candidates will have a background in library and information science, as well as strong editorial skills. Skills Required: Strong Internet skills--Web development skills a plus; Indexing and cataloging experience; familiarity with traditional classification schemes and controlled vocabularies, as well as Internet classification schemes; ability to work independently and in a team environment; 3-5 years professional experience. Skills Desired: MLS highly desired; Internet cataloging/indexing experience a plus; Journalism or writing background a plus. Education requirement: Master's degree ---------------------------------------------------------------------- -------- -- To apply for this position, simply forward your resume to the following addresses. Please clearly identify the Posting Number of the position you are applying for. Email: work4us@aol.com, careers@aol.net (text only, no attachments) Fax: 703-265-5769 Regular Mail: Web Products Attn: Patricia Harris Ref: PH326WP 22000 AOL Way Dulles, VA 20166